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Chunkster
malihini
65 Posts |
 Posted - 03/18/2007 : 08:12:17
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Comparing drilling though our very hard local lava rock to drilling though clay or limestone on the mainland might not be fair. Even so, it does seem awfully expensive, especially compared to the cost of a good catchment system.
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Rob Tucker
Kama'aina
4156 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2007 : 08:50:57
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| There was an effort to drill a water well adjacent to Pahoa Hardware which was abandoned after several weeks of drilling. Too many broken bits, not enough progress is what I was told. A very expensive proposition at that elevation. I think that the per foot charge has an extra charge for broken bits added to it. |
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Daniel
Da Kine
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2007 : 15:14:33
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Tolleys,
Thanks for your comment, it has brought up some good questions wich I will address soon. As for me, I love my well. I love the peace of mind that I get from knowing I have all the clean water I will ever need.
I am also preparing a list of people that we have drilled for who would be willing talk to you about their well. Just give me a call or send an email and I will be glad to give it too you. My number is 966-4129 and my email is danos_007@yahoo.com.
Mahalo, Daniel
Daniel R Diamond |
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Daniel
Da Kine
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2007 : 16:11:12
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Tolleys,
Thanks for asking about the cost difference between midwest wells and wells here in puna. Really there is no comparison. Things are very different out there, we found that out when we went back to Chicago to purchase our newest drill rig. The drilling industry is huge there. Nearly every new house has a water well. So it is very easy for drilling contractors to get parts, drill pipes, hammers, bits and other supplies. There is also a large pump industy to help keep them busy. Here in hawaii there are none. Everything we have comes from california or the midwest and costs a fortune to ship. Also the type of drilling the ground allows them to do there is much faster and simpiler and causes less wear on equipment. If the conditions were the same the cost for a well on the mainland would be similar to our cost here. We are doing our best to keep the prices down and hope to someday even lower them further. We know that a well is a big investment, thats why we garantee water, or you don't pay!(no money down either.)If you would like to know more about the differences in costs, just give me a call or email.
Take care, Daniel.
PS. Our minimum price for a 6 inch well is $5,000.00 not $5,500.00 as quoted by one of the posters. Also our cost Per foot includes much more than just drilling. It includes drilling 10" diameter hole (most mainland wells are 4"-5", the cost of drilling a 10 inch hole through rock is astronomically higher), 6" casing and basic well screen, gravel pack and grout seal. If we break a bit or have other problems during drilling we DO NOT charge the customer.
Daniel R Diamond
Edited by - daniel on 05/04/2007 08:47:42 |
Edited by - Daniel on 12/09/2008 08:56:43 |
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Daniel
Da Kine
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2007 : 16:25:34
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Rob,
Thanks for bringing that up. The well in pahoa market place is being drilled by another well driller. The client had some problems with funding so the driller pulled off the job until it can be resolved. As for the equipment, the driller didn't mention any problems with bits and such. That well will be close to 600 feet deep when finished.
Daniel R Diamond |
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Noel M2
Da Kine
USA
198 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2007 : 21:26:57
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I've been happy with the well that we installed. It was great to not have to deal with a huge catchment tank on our narrow lot (coastal HPP). One option that we considered was an underground concrete tank but the cost would have been comparable to that of the water well set up.
Additionally, with the lower rainfall by the coast and the vacation rental water consumption levels, we would have ended up buying water.
I plan to install wells in future projects that are at lower elevations.
Couple more comments...
- My well was installed by another contractor.
- Shop and compare prices but don't set your final expectations on what's done elsewhere. As noted above, there is a difference between poking through dirt vs lava.
- There should be a disinfection step in the final installation step. This will ensure that any contaminants introduced by the drilling process are cleaned up.
Noel
Edited by - Noel M2 on 03/20/2007 04:22:12 |
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Jeffhale
Da Kine
178 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2007 : 04:44:06
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Not to make trouble or argue with all this but, do not assume that where I live is 'just' dirt, ha ha.
The whole area has solid sedimentary rock. It was once the lead mining capital of the states, and there are tailings from the mining everywhere in a 100 mile radius. Locally the tailings are called Chat, this chat is Flintstone.
Check out the hardness level of Flintstone..
The contractor who I spoke with, in my area, said; If i checked around I could find people who undermine his price, as low as $5.50 a foot. Adding that; the reasons the prices are so low has nothing to do with the hardness of the ground or what to expect; It's simply competition.
Edited by - Jeffhale on 03/20/2007 04:51:42 |
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Daniel
Da Kine
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2007 : 19:50:27
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Jeffhale,
Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the mainland soil was only dirt, just that it is the most common. In fact there is much harder rock there than here, such as flintstone, like you said. Also you mentioned the competition in the midwest drilling market, you were very right, the competion is by far the heaviest in the nation, if not the world. Most well contractors there make more money on pumps and service than in drilling.
Thanks for your comments.
Aloha, Daniel.
Daniel R Diamond |
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Jeffhale
Da Kine
178 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2007 : 05:56:55
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Nothing like a little Competition to stir the market up eh Daniel. He.
I will have to admit that these details are unfamiliar to me and perhaps you've made a good point as to why the expense. I don't want to bother that contractor I spoke to last Sunday for details again but I do want to say a few things. I believe he quoted me for a 10-inch hole, although we did not discuss filling with mortar, rather just steel casing.
He added too his used rig cost around $500k and due to the competition it's difficult to make ends meet, especially if he was only going to drill a 100 foot hole. Including that there are several contractors who will drill holes this depth for water. I'd expect he would have commented on a smaller sized hole when he made this point, but can't say.
However, due to the mining and to make profits he could not afford to drill holes less than 500 feet. That, it is these depths which average 600 feet where drinking water is to be found Because, the water above these depths is contaminated, and that’s where his money is made, 500 feet plus. Includeing, as he said, costs for carbide steel bits are his expence.
So, in summery I believe he said 10 inch hole and at least 500 feet, which for this depth he makes profits.
And strangely enough due to the depth, my cost, here in the Midwest for drinking water, would be close to my cost on the Big island. 600 x $7 = $4,200 ( drilling) plus 600 feet of steel pipe, (steel aint cheap these days) plus pump and equipment. (gues-ta-mate) $6-7,000.
Wasn't it though Daniel, your charge was 110 a foot plus, meaning pipe and mortar fill is extra. Presuming I am correct about 10 inch diameter hole. My total cost here in the Midwest would not be more than $3,000, for 100 foot depth well.
It seems to me, the majority of expenses depends on the length of time to drill, at least in the Midwest. If it takes a day or two, the contractor earnes a gross of over 300 per day. if it takes a day or three to drill 100 feet in Hawaii, that's over $3,000 per day.
His comments about drilling on the big island and expenses were simply that there's less competition. Adding that, for what he knew there are contractors in Colorado who charge up to $60.00 a foot, And this was because of the lack of competition there which $60 a foot was the highest he knew of until I'd spoken with him.
Like I said though I do not intend to bother this fellow, wouldn't seem right to me, so I'll leave the ball in your court Daniel..
And I don’t want you or anybody to think that I’ve dredged this thread because I am disgruntled about the cost of a well for drinking water on the island. However, I am disappointed to have seen and learned of Several types of construction personal who work a week or two, make enough cash to take a week or two off and then comeback to work when they feel like it. And to have paid persons with equipment extraordinary amounts for their efforts ONLY because there’s not enough competition. If you don’t question expenses, you might as well write a blank check.
Living in Hawaii is a bit expensive, privileged perhaps, but living in Puna in comparison to the state is cheap. Personally I believe there’s to many people taking advantage of this fact.
If some people make enough money in a week or two to go on drunk for another week or two, they are over paid.
Edited by - Jeffhale on 03/21/2007 06:34:28
Edited by - Jeffhale on 03/21/2007 06:40:00 |
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StillHope
Punatic
USA
2473 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 11:21:00
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Daniel,I am asking this question mostly for my neighbors who considered not to have a well.Though they had different reasons,I think the cesspools in upper Sea View could have been their concern.
I've just found this thread and read your comments that cesspools are not a problem and you even said that the older the cesspool,the less problem it could possibly cause.
One client of yours has the well in my area.He uses revers osmosis.
But I heard it's very costly.
Does the UV filter you provide completely protects from bacteria contamination ?
Anyway,you said that the water was still clean at 125 ft elevation.
Can you be more specific how you sure about it?
Carey,if you happened to see this,may be you can comment too?
I would really appreciate it,as well as any other comments with some scientific information on the subject (or tests done).
Thank you in advance.
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Edited by - StillHope on 12/07/2008 07:58:06 |
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Sean
Da Kine
186 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2008 : 18:44:40
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Hi all, I've managed and designed many projects involving wells and putting wells near drainfields, let alone near cesspools, is not a questionable practice, it is a health issue. It is done, but in my opinion shouldn't be if there is another source of water such as catchment. And no, I don't own or work for a catchment company. For the record, cesspools are not very common on the mainland, something about contaminating the water table with viruses to nitrates and UV does not take out nitrates.
Hey Daniel, just curious, I would assume the the wells here are considered hard rock, why the gravel pack? Do the fractures continuously unload? What sort of development time frames do you typically use? Again, just curious, I'm a firm believer that well drillers who stay in business, must be doing it right.
Sean
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StillHope
Punatic
USA
2473 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 08:28:30
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Thanks,Sean.
I am not planning to drink the well water (as I wouldn't drink water from a catchment ),but you think with UV filter it's OK to use it for the shower?
In my case the well is only 6K more then a good catchment,and the catchment will take too much space of my already small lot. |
Edited by - StillHope on 12/08/2008 08:44:14 |
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Kapohocat
Punatic
USA
2796 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 10:53:46
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Still hope - Why not drink from a catchment if the proper filtration and treatment options are available? Some catchments are very safe (probably safer than our county water.)
Is it just a personal preference or is there a reason?
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StillHope
Punatic
USA
2473 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 12:07:45
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Kapohocat,I have several considerations against having the catchment(apart from the water quality),but I don't want to take this thread to a different direction.
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Edited by - StillHope on 12/08/2008 12:14:49 |
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Daniel
Da Kine
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 12/09/2008 : 09:14:18
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Aloha Nadya,
A UV is all you will need to safely drink your water. RO is used to remove dissolved solids. But to better help you understand call Karl at Pololei labs and talk to him about it. He does all our water testing and is an expert in that feild. His number is: 938-0560. We are looking forward to drilling when you are ready.
Daniel R Diamond |
Edited by - Daniel on 12/09/2008 09:18:38 |
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Considering a Water Well?
