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+--- Thread: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians (/showthread.php?tid=18340)
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - kalakoa - 04-26-2019
I have a much longer rant about how disappointed I am: humans should work together to solve global problems (eg, establish offworld colonies as a hedge against climate change) instead of the endless fighting over who owns what and how sacred it is.
What are we working on instead? A newer model of car ... that can self-drive ...
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 04-26-2019
What are we working on instead? A ... car ... that can self-drive ...
Possible outcomes:
1) Civil Beat engineer opinion writers solve the climate crisis while they commute to work in their self driving cars. They can now focus on problem solving instead of highway traffic for an extra hour or two a day.
2) Civil Beat engineer opinion writers watch historical fiction movies in their self driving cars while they commute to work. They believe the story is reality based. Then they write more faulty opinion pieces on their commute home.
"God has cared for these trees, but he cannot protect them from fools." - John Muir, 1897, arguing for the protection of our forests
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - TomK - 04-26-2019
I got used to reading and hearing so much claptrap against the TMT during the recent contested case hearing and court cases, but I have never read anything quite like this. What makes it worse is it was written by a UH professor, someone you would expect to at least have a tenuous grasp of reality. There is so much misinformation in the article it's hard to know where to start, but at least the related comments to the article have made some relevant ones. It's good to see that many realize what utter crap was written in that opinion piece.
Incidentally, the stuff about Mary and Jesus seems to have come about from a misprint, not that Jesus could have saved the rest of the article's nonsense:
"(Correction: Due to an editing error, Mara was changed to Mary in an earlier version of the story.)"
https://www.civilbeat.org/2019/04/the-canary-islands-seems-like-an-ideal-site-for-the-tmt/
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - TomK - 04-26-2019
MarkD claimed:
Academics in particular excel at this type of propaganda.
You tend to generalize and stereotype more than most, but in this case I'm very curious as to how you came to this opinion.
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - MarkP - 04-26-2019
This is just more of the same nonsense. It has been addressed repeatedly that the TMT will not displace any cultural activities apart from the modern day pursuit of publicly soiling oneself to get attention. So, desecrating a place of worship that is thousands of years old? Well first there is no desecration. Second there is no traditional worship at that site. Third the mountain itself is a million years old but the culture whose practices of worship we are arguing about has been here somewhat less than "thousands" of years, possibly only hundreds. Prior to their arrival it was a hunk of smoking rock.
So, more noise.
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - randomq - 04-27-2019
Now I'm really confused. Didn't Mara tempt Buddha? Ah well, religion is all made up ********, so I guess no harm in shuffling it up a bit.
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - Obie - 04-27-2019
From today's paper:
"Listen to just about any scientist and you hear not the slightest indication of an intention or desire to keep Maunakea from becoming another one of Hawaii’s cities. If you don’t believe such a thing can happen, just look at the small city that’s developed around the telescopes atop Haleakala."
https://www.hawaiitribune-herald.com/2019/04/27/opinion/your-views-for-april-27-6/
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - TomK - 04-27-2019
Yeah, I read that. That's quite a straw man. I suspect if a scientist was actually asked about turning Mauna Kea into a city they would tell you that's ridiculous and not something they want to do, for pretty obvious reasons. Some of those opposing the TMT and astronomy are really reaching the depths these days.
Incidentally, I'm a scientist and you haven't heard me say anything about an intention or desire to use the Big Island as an atomic bomb testing site.
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 04-28-2019
look at the small city that’s developed around the telescopes atop Haleakala."
Most of the activity on Haleakala is due to thousands of visitors driving up for the sunrise, a view of the crater and the silverswords. The National Park service has buildings and bathrooms for them. There’s a large paved parking lot. There are bus tours and bike tours.
Then, off to the side, mainly out of view from the tourist circus are the observatories, astronomers and support staff.
"God has cared for these trees, but he cannot protect them from fools." - John Muir, 1897, arguing for the protection of our forests
RE: Another take on TMT - Aggrieved native Hawaiians - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 04-28-2019
Among the observatories sited on Haleakala are AMOS and Pan-STARRS. Both track satellites and asteroids (see thread Please don't let Hawaii CD handle this... ).
If Earth is ever endangered by an asteroid strike, those observatories are our first line of defense.