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+--- Thread: **This Post is about HPP and HPPOA Dysfunction** (renamed to spare the uninterested) (/showthread.php?tid=23454)
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - mermaid53 - 11-02-2024
(11-02-2024, 12:59 AM)Obie Wrote: Well now she has her partner mermaid53 here, they are both members of the Krazy Karen Klick.THE TROLL HAS ARRIVED. His dinner bell must've gone off.
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - HiloJulie - 11-02-2024
(11-02-2024, 12:43 AM)mermaid53 Wrote:(10-26-2024, 07:05 PM)"HiloJulie Wrote: Question:
In the history of HPP, HPPOA and its predecessor, has ANY BOD member been elected with more than 500 votes? 250 votes? 100 votes?"
The answer is yes, more than 150 votes for a few candidates in 2018.
Which is why all of these faux subdivision associations are/were predetermined to be abject failures when less than 3% of the association voting membership actually votes.
And considering that the quorum threshold for HPP is at 30 eligible voting members out of 8,000 plus – even if you discount that to 4,000 possible voters, it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy for exactly what has been going on in HPP for decades.
RE: Unfinished Business, Waikahekahe, Bylaws, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - mermaid53 - 11-02-2024
(10-26-2024, 07:19 PM)ChunksterK Wrote: "The only agenda that matters is the figurative one held by the board of directors, and historically they have not always been honest about what that may be.
The best thing that could happen would be for the judge in one of the pending legal cases to put the HPPOA back under court supervision, something that happened in the 1990s. Independent competent management was hired, and property owners who were here at the time still refer to it as a sort of golden age. That is not, however, a long term solution. A multi-subdivision class action forcing the county to meet its responsibilities might be the key, but no less a figure than Harry Kim said in an open forum, "That would be just, but it would bankrupt the county." So do not expect help from politicians.
As others have said, self government does not work for HPP. It makes anarchy look preferable."
It's a vicious cycle. What we get every year is a new board with some still serving their 3 yr term, who are volunteer lot owners and oftentimes have ZERO road experience and very little business experience. Worse yet is when they're inexperienced, and or the treasurer has no financial experience, and they're "managing" over $3 million annual road fee income. 2 lawsuits (one of those include a 3rd party lawsuit) and 1 arbitration in 2 years are serious red flags. Then to go and tangle with a multi million $ investment corporation and drag them into the lawsuit to try and spank them for how they worded the deeds and make them pay for getting the BOD into a lawsuit over the deeds....wow.
Cart before the horse. They should've tried to negotiate with the Watumulls BEFORE as was suggested multiple times but ignored. Then they got sued by a lot owner who was well within her rights to do so as the deed provides that as a deterrent. So much for the deterrent as the board said they'd take their chances. One director said the deed was "archaic". This board also threw out the chances to explore professional mgmt out the window. The owners voted to do this but this board threw it out. Many owners are thinking we need to go back to receivership. BUT a private subdivision can't be under receivership forever....so what then?
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - Patricia - 11-02-2024
Aloha Mermaid,
"BUT a private subdivision can't be under receivership forever....so what then?"
Who says? Maybe not receivership, but they can be under professional management. We don't need an association for road maintenance- Watumull didn't either.
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - Punatang - 11-02-2024
(11-01-2024, 11:52 PM)Patricia Wrote: Aloha Punatang,
I have not pressured anyone to read/comments on this post and I have not posted any new posts since this one (October 27th)
How about High Pressure Proscription
Because that is what some of you are aiming for, isn't it? To make this post and any HPP post that addresses HPPOA dysfunction "illegal" or "prohibited?"
Same, old tactics, attack, ridicule, discredit, and if none of that works? Then censor.
Believe it or not, not every post is about you. If you knew your history, you would know that I am also guilty of a high quantity of posts regarding HPP and have been reprimanded by more than one Punnawebber for my transgressions. You would do well to get over yourself. I like your addition. I thought of two more.
Husbanded Poultry Park
H2O Pipeless Park
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - Patricia - 11-02-2024
Aloha Punatang,
Apologies. I do not know much about Punaweb history at all- just that there have been an amazing number of HPP and HPPOA posts over the years (from Punaweb's inception).
I know a lot, but not everything- I am aware. And I always welcome the opportunity to learn. So I appreciate your sharing.
And again, apologies if my reaction- after having dealt with so many HPPOA lemmings and bullies- seems like over-inflated ego. I definitely know my limitations.
RE: Unfinished Business, Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - mermaid53 - 11-02-2024
Chas "It's a shame that they came up with a creative solution to the mailbox problem, yet people who didn't like the solution (I.E. Can't walk to their mailbox anymore) have nothing better to do than try to force them to do what they want them to do. Even though what they want them to do has already been nixed by the post office. All the while wasting lots of money.
What would be great is if the post office said they are no longer going to service the existing boxes, then NO one would have mail delivery. Wonder how that would work out? Guess you have to sue the post office then. Oh no, force the HPP association to sue the post office, wasting even more money."
"Even though what they want them to do has already been nixed by the post office. All the while wasting lots of money." Curious....could you please clarify what it is that has "been nixed by the post office, while wasting lots of money"?
The mailbox project is complicated and there was an easier and less costly solution to the lack of mailboxes for some HPP lot owners. Over 2000 ppl already have HPP mailboxes and don't need new ones. How many ppl in HPP still need and want mailboxes? That's the question. There are also many ppl who don't want/need mailboxes in HPP but are already paying for them with their road fees. There was a simpler solution that could've served everyone who needed a mailbox and the board could've avoided lawsuits. They were aware of other alternatives to solve the issue before they broke ground on deed restricted land at the 4 mailbox sites.
The USPS never stated that they would no longer deliver to the road side boxes. This is false information being disseminated. They did NOT think that their delivery ppl were unsafe delivering to the road side mailboxes. They are the ones that installed the boxes there to begin with and sent those ppl to deliver mail at those locations. They wouldn't have done that if it was unsafe. The deliverers said they never felt unsafe delivering mail on the easement locations. This was/is misinformation reported by the board at board and membership meetings. For over 10 yrs of negotiations with the board and USPS, they have *never* dictated to HPPOA what they can/can't do as long as they didn't deviate from their own USPS regulations.
All HPP owners are still paying off a bond that was supposed to pave all of our roads. Now this board is diverting road fee monies to mailboxes instead of keeping up with road maint on dirt and existing paved roads, and paving a larger # of new roads. It costs approx $420,000 to pave one mile the last I heard. We're close to, or at $1 million into the mailbox project.
A majority of owners will be traveling down the main roads several times a week, double backing to pick up their mail, thereby increasing traffic on our already degrading main roads. Parcel delivery could become a concern with only 1 parcel box to 25 mailboxes at the new sites. Currently installed is only 16 parcel boxes with over 2000 mailboxes at 4th and Kaloli. The current easement cluster boxes are 2 parcel boxes to 16 mailboxes and we occasionally have to go to the post ofc to pick up parcels. With the board's mailbox plan, we may be standing in long lines at the post ofc and more often. Amazon only ships via USPS now and a lot of ppl shop at Amazon. Vandalism could be an issue with so many mailboxes in one spot. The USPS agreed that this could be a problem. But they aren't the ones who'll have to replace them...HPPOA's road fees will have to pay to replace boxes. One way in/out with approx 2000 mailboxes at each site. Fingers crossed at what we'll be dealing with in the future. The judge could rule to remove them so there's that too.
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - leilanidude - 11-02-2024
Over 2000 ppl already have HPP mailboxes and don't need new ones.
-----------
So what is wrong with accommodating the rest of the subdivision?
Vandalism will go down if there are 2,000 mailboxes per site as that means a lot of folks coming/going to a singular location, which will have lighting, etc.
Ultimately, the USPS could simply tell HPP that the current mailbox situation will be not delivered to as of xx/xx/xxxx date.
Better to find an acceptable solution now - HPP has been growing population (number of houses) for the last few years and people want mailboxes, not trips to the post office.
RE: Unfinished Business, Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - ChunksterK - 11-02-2024
(11-02-2024, 06:51 AM)mermaid53 Wrote: Parcel delivery could become a concern with only 1 parcel box to 25 mailboxes at the new sites. Currently installed is only 16 parcel boxes with over 2000 mailboxes at 4th and Kaloli.
And this is exactly why the Frau and I will continue to pick up our mail and parcels at the Hilo Airport when we go to town. The HPP post boxes are run out of the Keaau USPS location, a place that is already overcrowded, poorly run, and staffed by some of the surliest people in in the postal system. We will glady continue to pay for the privilege of doing business in Hilo and know quite a few other HPP residents who feel the same way.
Forgive me if this question has already been answered, but will the USPS allow the shiny new boxes to be used with pending litigation? It would be the icing on the cake if they sat there deteriorating in the rain and sun while all this plays out in court.
RE: *This Post Is About HPP* Waikahekahe, WATUMULL'S, Owners/Members Meeting 10/27/2024 - Patricia - 11-02-2024
Aloha all,
Mailboxes are a very SMALL part of this HPPOA board's overreach. And this post does not even mention mailboxes in the title, as we have all gone down that rabbit hole before.
Different HPP Owners want a lot of things. But the fact is, HPP Owners pay for one thing- roads. That's it. HPP Owners do not pay to have mailboxes installed. They do not pay to have lighting for those mailboxes installed. HPP Owners do not pay, so that HPPOA can siphon off 10s of thousands of dollars to fix the clubhouse, or add an addition to their office. HPP Owners pay restricted road maintenance fee money and it should stay that way- restricted.
HPPOA is not a mandatory community association and the HPPOA board should not be applying law (421J) that does not apply. The HPPOA board should not be trying to gut their bylaws to force Owners to be members of their club and give the HPPOA board more power, more authority, and more control over HPP Owner road fee money so that they can "do whatever they want."
Don't have a mailbox? Neither do we. We pay for one- A LOT. Don't want to pay for one? Then how about a group starts petitioning the USPS to do something? How about that group starts putting pressure on the USPS to cough up hundreds of thousands of dollars, seeing as they have been given BILLIONS in federal monies and fulfill their obligations? Those HPP Owners who want mailboxes need to start rolling up their sleeves- because taking restricted road fee money to get "whatever you want" is not an answer that some of us are going to accept.
This post is about the HPPOA board's overreach. This post is about the HPPOA board's breach of Fiduciary Duty. This post is about violating deed restrictions and the conditions of a settlement. This post is about ignoring the importance of a cultural site/study and putting it on the back burner (as usual). This post is about "so much more" than just mailboxes.