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+--- Thread: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition (/showthread.php?tid=15831)
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - opihikao - 05-02-2015
quote:There is no link, nor story in the media, yet. Maybe call the Gov.'s office to verify. My source was in the meeting held. FWIW.
Originally posted by TomK
I've yet to find anything online that mentions the possibility of the National Guard potentially being called out with respect to the TMT protestors. Maybe something will appear Saturday, but am a little skeptical right now. A link to the source of this story would be helpful.
Sounds like the protestors/protectors have been put on notice TMT will proceed.
JMO.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-02-2015
"For those, like Kapoho Joe, who may have missed it, I think this earlier post by punafish, and the link included, is well worth reading"
What on earth does that have to do with anything, let alone a telescope?
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-02-2015
"many Western minds are seriously under-developed"
Now there we have the real root of the problem, that people like you feel no shame in writing things like that.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Mtviewdude - 05-02-2015
quote:
Originally posted by MattKarma
Just the way things work. You want something done in Hawaii, or anywhere else in the world the locals will try to milk it for everything they can. Even after there is an agreement, if they decide they can get more out of it they will kick up a fuss until it pays.
The only source of western cash in some places, exploited ... you don't usually feel sorry for the oil companies.
Now if we really want 'revenge' we'll cancel the TMT all together.
It may be best for all. Many Hawaiians seriously need a diet .... AND THEY KNOW IT.
Normally I would call you out on your racism, but lately i can't be bothered.
After seeing increasing racism shown by the native hawaiians I can't think of anything more poetic then letting the groups of hate mongers go after each other.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Mtviewdude - 05-02-2015
quote:
Originally posted by dakine
For those, like Kapoho Joe, who may have missed it, I think this earlier post by punafish, and the link included, is well worth reading
quote:
Originally posted by punafish
Interesting discussion. Just to add a little spice, new research that questions many assumptions we hold near and dear to our hearts, for example the impact of culture on behavior, cognition, even our individual "hardwiring". Here's a fascinating article that touches on the concept of "cultural memory" (but definitely not "racial"). A snippet:
"Studies show that Western urban children grow up so closed off in man-made environments that their brains never form a deep or complex connection to the natural world. While studying children from the U.S., researchers have suggested a developmental timeline for what is called “folkbiological reasoning.” These studies posit that it is not until children are around 7 years old that they stop projecting human qualities onto animals and begin to understand that humans are one animal among many. Compared to Yucatec Maya communities in Mexico, however, Western urban children appear to be developmentally delayed in this regard. Children who grow up constantly interacting with the natural world are much less likely to anthropomorphize other living things into late childhood.
Given that people living in WEIRD societies don’t routinely encounter or interact with animals other than humans or pets, it’s not surprising that they end up with a rather cartoonish understanding of the natural world. “Indeed,” the report concluded, “studying the cognitive development of folkbiology in urban children would seem the equivalent of studying ‘normal’ physical growth in malnourished children.”
http://www.psmag.com/books-and-culture/joe-henrich-weird-ultimatum-game-shaking-up-psychology-economics-53135
For people who clamor about disrespecting native hawaiian culture, you sure like to crap on western cultures.
As far as I am concerned crap away, just don't get upset when your are shown the same amount disrespect as you show.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-02-2015
Yes, drive in your car to get to your computer and post on the internet how awful the West is.
I still don't see why this means a telescope can't be built on Mauna Kea.
I feel sorry for racists, it's usually because of a lack of education.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PunaMauka2 - 05-02-2015
lol check out the "diplomatic" version of dakine predictably honing in on and cherry picking the ripe phrase underlined.
my god this paper changes everything!
before you get too excited thinking you have found something of merit in support of your spectacular visions of global racial segregation i hope you realize they are not hypothesizing about behavioral differences in connection with "race", but rather the social environments of lifestyles far removed from most developed nations
"..differences that lie between the Hawaiian and Western minds."
...and they aren't quite talking about folks among the people of Hawaii in 2015 identifying with their cultural past (not a criticism) between driving around on highways to and from work and shopping in a post-idustrial society. sorry.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - JohnDW - 05-02-2015
That's a fascinating article, but I'm not altogether surprised. Yes, the stereotypical "American" mind is weird as they say. But other words might be less pejorative. While misreading the Miller-Lyer Illusion suggests Americans do not see reality for what it is, it also helps to explain why they appear to be so gifted at abstract reasoning. An example of that is the Dawn spacecraft visiting asteroids not visible to the naked eye; yet, ever so real. Are any of those asteroids composed of rare elements? I can't help but wonder what might have happened if the Hawaiian people would have discovered a source of copper, tin, or iron. Going now from macro to micro; are there life forms on any of those asteroids that might become a boon to mankind?, it's possible that many of us are alive today because atoms were arranged to produce chemicals that defeated certain hostile microorganisms. Indeed, the electrons that illuminate this screen are understood in the abstract.
Going back to the beginning of the article where they discuss the ultimatum game and the Machiguenga, I couldn't help but draw comparisons to recent revelations occurring here in Hawaii County, and how some people shrug certain behaviors off as excusable, while others see these behaviors as inherently dishonest, predictors of future behaviors, and indeed, characteristic of an inherent world view.
Henrich’s problems with UBC may also be interpreted in ways other than those suggested by the author Ethan Waters. Although I've not taken time to read the academic paper itself, the language this team has chosen may be construed as offensive by would-be employers and colleagues. Other perspectives of the same phenomena may slant the paper in another direction altogether. While there maybe academic merit in the research team's observations, their conclusions may also be as twisted as their weird Western minds. But hey, at least they're thinking; got to give them credit for that.
Un Mojado Sin Licencia
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - TomK - 05-02-2015
Having read the paper (not the news article), I think all the authors are saying is that the population of the western society cannot solely be used as a behavioral study for everyone else on the planet. How is this surprising and what has it to do with the TMT?
http://www2.psych.ubc.ca/~henrich/pdfs/Weird_People_BBS_final02.pdf
"The comparative findings suggest that members of Western, educated,industrialized, rich, and democratic societies, including young children, are among the least representative populations one could find for generalizing about humans."
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - ironyak - 05-03-2015
The inability to apply the findings of the study to the situation may be more evidence of the study's conclusion: that Western, Educated, Industrialized, Rich, and Democratic views tend to be more analytical and object-focused than holistic and background-focused as compared to the rest of world.
Or to put it another way, what could 1000+ years of culture tied to the land and Mauna Kea possibly have anything to do with building a telescope there?