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+--- Thread: Steel Stud Framing in Puna (/showthread.php?tid=17423)
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RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - kaialoha - 07-28-2016
Mahalo for the breadth and scope of responses. Pretty much they were as I thought they would be so MAHALO, one and all, for the affirmation.
The initial reason I even brought the up the subject is that in prior posts in 'Building in Puna' there seemed to be a narrow focus on 'wood' as a construction element without ever seeming to address steel studs as a completely reasonable and viable to wood.
When my company built Maui Park Plaza I dealt with a Steel Stud Framing Contractor from O'ahu, whose name evades me at the moment, and he used some substantial material that was by any standard extraordinarily sturdy and the finished product was incomparable. One particular note about SSF: In larger buildings and I imagine even large residential projects, the roof MUST be loaded FIRST prior to installing any kind of siding over SSF, ie, EIFS, etc. Otherwise there is the possibility of deformation resulting in cracks and the like due to SSF's flexibility.
Rob Tucker:
Mahalo for the decoupling comment! Makes absolutely perfect sense. I imagine neoprene strips could be placed to the outside of the SSF prior to any siding going up. I wonder, is there a specific product for this?
Also, mahalo for the comment about painting cut ends of the SSF members with Galvanized Paint. It DEF adds to the cost of framing (extra labor and materials) but must be considered essential to a proper installation and ultimately the longevity of the SSF. I suppose a well designed project with detailed materials list could help minimize that problem, ie, DON'T order 10' studs when you know you're building a 9' wall.
With a life span of 100 years for SSF and ONLY 3 years for Hi-Bor, isn't using SSF basically a no-brainer? It seems like it to me, anyway!
Carey:
AWESOME!! I was VERY MUCH hoping I'd get a response for the 'Hardi-Backer as Siding' issue and voila', there you are. Mahalo for the insight as an actual bona fide user. Again, You've affirmed what I believed could be possible. I've used Hardi-Backer with a 3-layer RedGuard coating on 'wet areas' and the water penetration factor is ABSOLUTELY ZERO! Indeed, Hardi-Backer IS 'saw/blade eating' and that aligns with my own experience as well. As I recall, Hardi recommends AGAINST 'sawing' the materials, rather they instruct to 'score and snap'. Apparently the components that make up Hardi-Backer in 'dust' form, ie, from sawing, is NOT such a good thing to be breathing in. SO, if one were to go the route of using saws, which I will DEF be doing, I HIGHLY suggest a full filtration mask system when doing so. Thanks again for the information!
The_Saints:
To answer your question, I redid a home in Del Mar, SoCali for the daughter of the owner of Winston Tires and we used a Hardi-Backer like materials HORIZONTALLY with 'bats' placed horizontally and then caulked prior to painting. The 'look' was simply awesome. It was modern, yet had a cottage feel that was perfect, imho. So, with that experience I kinda' fell in love with that look and so that's what I'm going with. On top of that, though, I DO NOT like the 'clapboard' look. Totally a personal preference.
Incidentally, on this project, Susan (the client) ordered all of her exterior doors, windows, and sliding glass doors from a company in Europe. I believe Switzerland. These items were made from bronze! NOT KIDDING! And they were unbelievably sturdy and gorgeous. The bill for JUST these units, and this house was basically a 'cottage' of about 1,200 SqFt, was a WHOPPING $400,000. These units were 'security' units that had lugs that penetrated into the floor and headers that were made of hardened steel (which came with the units) and the glass was bullet proof double pane. EXTRAORDINARY!!! Susan bought the place for $3MIL and then sunk $5MIL into redoing it and just the year before it had a $1.5MIL upgrade done through-out. Must be nice to have that much money! LOL
Mahalo folks for the GREAT information and sharing! I am indebted to you.
AWESOME!!
Mahalo a Aloha
Punanny
RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - ElysianWort - 07-28-2016
I want to practice and build a tool shed out of this stuff. Where on Oahu, what company sells the steel studs? How about the spay on zinc treatment for the cut ends?
RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - Rob Tucker - 07-28-2016
On Oahu you can order steel stud material, cut to length, from G.W. Killebrew.
I can't say on the spray zinc for Oahu. In Hilo the spray zinc is sold at GasPro.
RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - Carey - 07-29-2016
Kalaloha, the sawing we did was for things like sawing holes for plumbing & outlet box cutting, things that are not possible to do with "score & snap" (& we did use either respirator or vac recovery when we did any sawing (be aware that even the score & snap can bring up dust...). We did not use RedGuard in our wet ares, instead went with the Schulter Kerdi membrane system for our no-barrier 6ft shower/wet restroom, mainly to not have to redo the whole floor & used the Kerdi integral drain system....
Decoupling can be done with many products, with each having pros/cons list (be aware that metal roof systems attached to metal framing will also be area that may need decoupling, as the heat conduction can also occur there. Our framing system has extruded integral aluminum that penetrate the wall envelope, so we added a insulating reflective barrier within the wall to minimize heat exchange, as decoupling was not an option.
RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - kaialoha - 07-31-2016
Aloha Carey,
I understand what you did and have a LOT of respect for you for managing to tackle the difficulties it took to cut holes, etc. KUDOS!!
Interestingly enough Hardie Company HIGHLY recommends AGAINST sawing or any type of cutting operation that creates dust, which stands to reason, because of the high silica content of the material. However, I believe with proper protection, ie, any one of the dust masks available at Home Depot, an installer should be able to alleviate any worries about this problem.
But, just to be clear, I'm referring to HardiBACKER, NOT HardiPANEL. Of course the difference is that 'backer' is used for tile backing and at floors, walls, and ceilings of showers, mainly, or any other area that may come into contact with lots of moisture. And 'panel' is specifically designed for a finished look similar to wood clapboard. I am NOT interested in the 'wood' look but rather a smooth and seamless flat wall punctuated only by horizontal battens similar to a vertical bat n board system. It would appear the backer, though not specifically designed for it, is IDEALLY suited as a 'siding' material with a couple of caveats that need to be addressed via finished product specifications.
Anyway, again, MAHALO for all the interesting points and comments ~ ~ ~
Aloha ~ ~ ~
Kaihekili
RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - David M - 07-31-2016
Steel studding used to be available at Honsador, don't know if currently available.
Ninole Resident
Please visit vacation.ninolehawaii.com
RE: Steel Stud Framing in Puna - MarkP - 08-01-2016
I understand that the Hardi-board planks for siding are not supposed to be installed in the splash zone near the ground as they wont stand up to constant wetting. OTOH I built a raised bed by taking what I assume was Hardi-backer or the equivalent, cutting a 4' x 8' sheet into 1' x 8' strips, overlapping and bolting the ends, and making a 10' diameter by 1' high ring. It's been a couple of years and it has not failed yet. I can't imagine worse conditions for a material to endure except we don't get the freeze-thaw cycle.