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+--- Thread: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. (/showthread.php?tid=22783)
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - Space Karen - 07-30-2022
(07-30-2022, 02:25 AM)kalianna Wrote: No one's mentioned this, but isn't the lack of rain problematic? Aren't the upper reaches of the mauna very arid?
There are always ways around that.
Condensation towers could be built to passively pull water from air (somewhat like moisture farmers in star wars with their small condensers).
Persians built towers for pigeons to roost, over the last 10,000 years, to make it easier to collect bird droppings as crop fertilizer:
https://www.notechmagazine.com/2016/10/pigeon-towers-a-low-tech-alternative-to-synthetic-fertilizers.html
Most problems are easy to solve. There is little profit in solving them. While those who cause problems get piles of cash thrown their way.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - TomK - 07-30-2022
There aren't many pigeons, or any other birds, flying above the upper slopes of Mauna Kea, and good luck getting planning permission to build condensation towers up there, even if they work in Star Wars. BTW, Kalianna, I have already mentioned the difficulty of getting anything to grow about the treeline on Mauna Kea in another thread. There's a reason why the area is so barren.
I also appreciate the diagram Oink posted, but will point out that's for Mexico and not an island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. I don't think growing potatoes is an option on MK.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - Space Karen - 07-30-2022
(07-30-2022, 07:50 AM)TomK Wrote: and good luck getting planning permission to build condensation towers up there
People in africa and around the world use condensation towers to generate water in arid conditions. (even in star wars bruh)
Its a known and proven technology.
I don't know why it would be a big deal. If people want water in arid regions, there are available methods.
Why fuss over it.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - TomK - 07-30-2022
(07-30-2022, 12:38 PM)Space Karen Wrote:(07-30-2022, 07:50 AM)TomK Wrote: and good luck getting planning permission to build condensation towers up there
People in africa and around the world use condensation towers to generate water in arid conditions. (even in star wars bruh)
Its a known and proven technology.
I don't know why it would be a big deal. If people want water in arid regions, there are available methods.
Why fuss over it.
I won't fuss about it, but I think you'll find a lot of other people aren't too happy about building stuff on the mountain. It's a big deal to them.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 07-30-2022
OK.
Here is some basic info on the Mauna Kea orchard:
https://keolamagazine.com/food/fabled-fruit-orchard/
Somebody tried growing apples at 6000 foot elevation, the trees survived, but there is no orchard industry. Most likely because land is expensive, and fruit production is so low per tree and per acre you can’t make a living in the business. Growing an apple in your yard is far different from growing for market.
Condensation towers: have you ever seen an orchard watered by condensation towers? I haven’t. Also, condensation towers only work in low humidity, not the 70-90% humidity levels in Hawaii.
Potatoes: they will grow in Hawaii, and for a brief two years 1850-1851 there was a potato industry in the islands:
“In 1851 Irish potatoes were exported to the amount of 43,923 barrels, sweet potatoes to the amount of 56,717 barrels. Eighteen fifty-one was a year of disasters in California and of drought and depression in Hawaii.”
https://imagesofoldhawaii.com/nu-kaliponi/
Gold rush prices made it possible, a return to normal supply, demand, and pricing made it impossible to make a living selling Irish potatoes grown in the islands.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - Punaperson - 07-30-2022
Re: potatoes
When I was taking ag classes at UHH (a long, long time ago), I remember reading about how the potato fields of Ka'u supplied most of the American military in the South Pacific during WWII. Just as the sugar cane yields were very high in Hawaii in comparison to other growing areas, the rich soil and mild climate allowed for high production and several crops per year. But then after a rainy period just after the war ended, a fungus ( a phytophthora if memory serves ) turned everything into a rotten mess. Because there's no freezing temperatures to kill off the fungus, and at that time there were no suitable fungicides, the crop was abandoned after several attempts to replant. ( I tried a quick google search to find more detail, but was unsuccessful. I do remember the info was in several pieces in the yearly Territorial statistic documents in the Special Collections Vault at the UHH library. )
To SpaceKaren: in an earlier post, you said you had planted potatoes in containers using potting soil. Just out of curiosity, how much did they end up costing per pound after factoring in the cost of the pots and soil?
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - Space Karen - 07-30-2022
(07-30-2022, 12:55 PM)TomK Wrote:(07-30-2022, 12:38 PM)Space Karen Wrote:(07-30-2022, 07:50 AM)TomK Wrote: and good luck getting planning permission to build condensation towers up there
People in africa and around the world use condensation towers to generate water in arid conditions. (even in star wars bruh)
Its a known and proven technology.
I don't know why it would be a big deal. If people want water in arid regions, there are available methods.
Why fuss over it.
I won't fuss about it, but I think you'll find a lot of other people aren't too happy about building stuff on the mountain. It's a big deal to them.
Its a big deal to them.
I couldn't care less.
If people of hawaii want to pursue food independence and sustainability. It makes sense to cultivate cold weather crops in the cold climate. Its a no brainer.
But if people don't want it. That's cool.
(07-30-2022, 11:06 PM)Punaperson Wrote: Re: potatoes
When I was taking ag classes at UHH (a long, long time ago), I remember reading about how the potato fields of Ka'u supplied most of the American military in the South Pacific during WWII. Just as the sugar cane yields were very high in Hawaii in comparison to other growing areas, the rich soil and mild climate allowed for high production and several crops per year. But then after a rainy period just after the war ended, a fungus ( a phytophthora if memory serves ) turned everything into a rotten mess. Because there's no freezing temperatures to kill off the fungus, and at that time there were no suitable fungicides, the crop was abandoned after several attempts to replant. ( I tried a quick google search to find more detail, but was unsuccessful. I do remember the info was in several pieces in the yearly Territorial statistic documents in the Special Collections Vault at the UHH library. )
To SpaceKaren: in an earlier post, you said you had planted potatoes in containers using potting soil. Just out of curiosity, how much did they end up costing per pound after factoring in the cost of the pots and soil?
I took 2 small slices from a potato bought at target. Let the cut portions crust over and dry out for a few days. Which some say helps protect against fungal infection. Planted in the top part of a 2 gallon container. No compost. Grass clippings from the lawn mower covering the top, to make it harder for weed spores & seeds to reach soil and grow. So there is less need to be constantly pulling weeds.
Planted april 22, 2022. Harvested july 26, 2022 when vegetation was declining, to see if anything grew in there.
Yielded between 1 to 2 pounds of small potatos. Undersize potatos maybe half of normal size.
Just to see how well potatos grow here with a minimal effort.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - kalianna - 07-31-2022
And there we have it, proof positive that's it's possible to grow undersize potatoes in East Hawaii, which therefore proves that growing potatoes on the mauna is worth the effort. Do we need to wait for the water condensation towers to do this?
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - Obie - 07-31-2022
You can grow potatoes from store bought potatoes, but they are often treated with clorproham (an herbicide/sprout inhibitor). Potatoes without sprouts are more attractive on store shelves. However, treated potatoes take longer to sprout, and the resulting plants may show stunted growth.
RE: Support Local 2.? Just do eat. - terracore - 07-31-2022
We have been growing potatoes here for years. They do best when the days are getting longer. I don't remember what they are called but the gold ones seem to do best. Once the greens come out of the ground the crop is done in about 2 months. So small yield but the bed is quickly ready to grow something else.