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+--- Thread: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service (/showthread.php?tid=22786)
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - Space Karen - 07-30-2022
Images of the plane are initial renderings and not final design. But.
The engines look like they're mounted too close together. Prop wash could cancel a decent amount of engine thrust. The wing design looks more like a hydrofoil than an aircraft wing.
...
A blimp or airship could be a good platform for hawaii interisland flight. It could also double as a platform for moving freight interisland economically. It wouldn't molest whales or wildlife. And could offer better rates with lower fuel economy. The only hit would be to transit time. But the distance between islands being small in the grand scheme of things, it wouldn't matter much and could be made up for in greater cargo capacity.
There wasn't a good method for landing airships. That was a major hiccup for airports and fields supporting them. Today with drones, it might be possible to use them as tugboats to land airships more safely and accurately.
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - Obie - 07-30-2022
A quick lesson. They have all of those engines and propellers to create more airflow over the wing, it creates lift and they use ground effect for the rest.
My concern is where would it touch down when flying in to Hilo.
This will be a Kona only deal.
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - 'elepaio - 07-30-2022
Use the inside buoys Obie ? I think long enough.
Need to check + effects of crosswind too on this style lift.
e.out
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - Space Karen - 07-30-2022
(07-30-2022, 06:06 AM)Obie Wrote: A quick lesson. They have all of those engines and propellers to create more airflow over the wing, it creates lift and they use ground effect for the rest.
This is what I think of it.
1. It looks like it has a hydrofoil on the bottom. Hydrofoils work good for surfboards in hawaii. But they are terrible for ships and planes. Hydrofoils were tested in hawaii back around the 1960s or 1970s. They spent most of their time in drydock due to the oceans in hawaii being too rough and putting too much stress on the foils. The foil blades will definitely take a beating here and it will translate to higher maintenance and upkeep, on a component that is completely unnecessary.
2. The wings have moving parts and tilt up/down. Moving parts on stressed structural components like wings translates to greatly increased maintenance and upkeep costs. The US militaries osprey tilt wing rotor is one of the prime examples of this issue. Tilt wing is also completely unnecessary
3. The engines are mounted too close together. There hasn't been a propeller aircraft with engines mounted that closely together built in almost 100 years. Placing propellers too close together, cancels thrust. The vortex of wind that trails the propeller, will clash with the vortex next to it. And they will actually cancel each other out to some degree.
4. There is no need for 8 engines, or special wing designs to generate lift. They're not lifting anything especially heavy. Only a few passengers and whatever cargo they can fit on the small frame.
5. What is needed is stability in crosswinds. Ocean water cooling for lithium batteries. A hull resistant to barnacles and ocean worms. Retractable landing gear allowing it to touch down normally on runway if needed. Fast charge time and good charging options near slip berths. Non toxic building materials. Etcetera.
6. They could have taken existing seaplanes. Stripped the fossil fuel engines out. Replaced them with electric motors. Renovate the interior with passenger seats and windows. It probably would have ended up being much more affordable, reliable. And overall better.
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - TomK - 07-30-2022
Jeeze, this is pahoated on speed.
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - bgiles - 07-30-2022
This is an "artist's" conception of something fantasized. The power units should be on top of the wings, for starters. Click bait.
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - Space Karen - 07-30-2022
(07-30-2022, 02:42 PM)bgiles Wrote: This is an "artist's" conception of something fantasized. The power units should be on top of the wings, for starters. Click bait.
That's a good point.
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 07-31-2022
SeaFlite Hawaii, an inter island jetfoil that operated in the 1970’s.
Honolulu to Kona, $25.
Video from an episode of Hawaii 5-0.
https://maui-meshworks.com/seaflite_histFd.htm
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - terracore - 07-31-2022
Here's a successful fast ferry. I did the round trip. https://www.clippervacations.com/vessel-information/
Here's a lemon. I never rode it because it was always out for maintenance. When it wasn't ingesting logs it was sidelined with engineering defects. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV_Fairweather
RE: Hawaiian Air Harbor to Harbor Seaglider Service - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 07-31-2022
Surface catamaran ferries and jetfoils move at 35 knots.
The Hawaiian Air, and Mokulele Air sea glider will travel at 160 knots. 180 mph.
It’s a different beast.