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+--- Thread: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition (/showthread.php?tid=15831)
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-04-2015
We Support TMT - Please sign the petition
http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/wesupporttmt.html
6760 so far
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - kalakoa - 05-04-2015
Who cares if it's in Puna? Are you a YIMBY?
No, but nor do I believe that adding 170 tech jobs in Waimea will have a substantial impact on the Puna economy.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-04-2015
Maybe, but we in Puna benefit from the taxes paid, amongst many other benefits.
Hopefully that's enough to satisfy the "yes, but what's in it for me" viewpoint.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Justin - 05-04-2015
It'd be nice to have some top-notch facilities in Waimea or Hilo as opposed to having to fly to Honolulu. Just my opinion.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PunaMauka2 - 05-04-2015
inter-district commerce IS substantial, both directly and indirectly. i happen to see the direct in action for a lot of folks all the time.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - kalakoa - 05-04-2015
I suppose we should be grateful the protestors didn't try to stop the Saddle Road.
Excellent example. As usual, I find the arguments tiresome and some of the justifications are flimsy at best -- Saddle Road is probably a worse desecration; PTA is definitely worse. Where were the protestors? (Or: why didn't anyone pay attention, and how was it resolved?)
Why aren't the protestors marching on DHHL and OHA?
Note that while I support the TMT generally, its impact on Puna will still be limited: strengthening the island economy doesn't translate into Puna getting a larger share than it does currently. Unlike Kona resort jobs, these workers won't commute from Puna.
Perhaps if Telcom rolled out universal broadband in honor of TMT, to promote STEM for the next generation by making the telescope accessible to all who live on the island...
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - ironyak - 05-04-2015
Originally posted by PunaMauka2
i can tell you this idea that we just can't understand each other on par with what ironyak seems to be suggesting is quite a stretch, to put it mildly.
To be clear, it's what the authors are stating, not me. You did read the study right? Given your constant berating of certain views, especially those differing in folkbiology and analytical style, how can you not be aware that your views differ substantially from many of those around you and those differences limit a shared understanding?
Thanks for the link - the author was quite enthusiastic and supportive of the study by Henrich, Heine, and Norenzayan. He even managed to speak about you?
http://neuroanthropology.net/2010/07/10/we-agree-its-weird-but-is-it-weird-enough/
"If that colleague still doesn’t get it, please stop talking to them. Really. You. Are. Wasting. Your. Breath. If Henrich, Heine and Norenzayan don’t shake their confidence, I’m not sure what can."
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - TomK - 05-04-2015
Kalakoa,
"Note that while I support the TMT generally, its impact on Puna will still be limited: strengthening the island economy doesn't translate into Puna getting a larger share than it does currently. Unlike Kona resort jobs, these workers won't commute from Puna."
Although I agree that the TMT won't have a significant impact in Puna, I suspect it will have some although probably not not obvious. All the Hilo based observatories employ people living in Puna (and even Waimea's-based Keck employ people on the east side of the island). Back in 2005, nearly every scientist employed by the Joint Astronomy Centre lived in Puna along with several computing staff and a large number of engineering staff. That number started to drop as commuting became more difficult and the JAC reduced staffing, but a significant number (including myself) remained in Puna. We are all relatively well paid and much of our wages go into the local Puna economy. This is free money for Puna as the source of our wages comes from out-of-state sources.
The last I heard, the TMT are planning on building their operations center/offices in Hilo, in fact they were very interesting in using the old JAC building although that has since fallen through I believe. Given the commuting problems between Puna and Hilo are easing a little, I see no reason why many TMT employees won't live in Puna and contribute to our local economy.
It's not significant, I agree, and probably impossible to quantify, but it's not as if anyone in Puna has to do anything to make it happen, other than apply for the jobs.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - rainyjim - 05-04-2015
This is free money for Puna as the source of our wages comes from out-of-state sources.
Following this logic, is all money in Hawai'i free?
I had a grin.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - shockwave rider - 05-05-2015
Kalakoa: "Note that while I support the TMT generally, its impact on Puna will still be limited: strengthening the island economy doesn't translate into Puna getting a larger share than it does currently. Unlike Kona resort jobs, these workers won't commute from Puna."
You are dead wrong on this. I have had multiple neighbors here in Puna through the years who work for the Mauna Kea telescopes. Quite a few of the telescope jobs are filled with people who do choose to live in Puna. The HPP and Volcano communities in particular have telescope employees living in them.