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+--- Thread: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage (/showthread.php?tid=11129)
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - Midnight Rambler - 12-04-2012
Related to what James mentioned, this is not restricted to places with heavy human traffic. It seems that in most groups that go backpacking to Waimanu Valley, at least one person comes back with a flesh-eating bacterial infection.
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - Kelena - 12-04-2012
Disturbing information. On a technical note, I think the correct name of this site is "Waiopae" and not "Wai Opea". Not sure what, if anything, "Waiopae" means. Perhaps "Water where shrimp (or crabs) are found", as "opae" is shrimp or crab and "wai" is water. Corrections to my guess appreciated.
But the thrust of the diary needs no correction: there is a failure of the community, the county and the state to ameliorate this problem. Only the government can correct it as the homeowners are unwilling to do so voluntarily. They are to be congratulated for providing a toilet there. Unfortunately, their OWN toilets all drain into the water, untreated. This is not their fault. They were allowed to do so by the government. Government should now step in.
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - csgray - 12-05-2012
Wai means water. I found this definition for opea using one of the online Hawaiian dicitonaries from this site:
www.wehewehe.org
there was no definition for waiopea or wai opea. I have seen it spelled both ways on maps and by agencies involved in the area.
opea
1. nvt. To twist, bind, or cross the hands, as behind the back; to throw over the shoulder, as a shawl; to overturn, overthrow; to evict, as a tenant; to trip, as with a spear thrust between the legs. Fig., to deceive, trick, treat treacherously; treachery. Ka 'ope'a aku i ka mea pono ma ka ho'okolokolo 'ana(Sol. 18.5), to trip up the righteous man in trial. ho.'o.pe'a;a Treacherous, overturning; to cause to twist, cross, etc.
2. n. Scrotum.
3. n. Small boom or spar to extend and elevate the sails of a canoe.
Carol
edited to fix weird formatting of the diacritical marks when I cut and pasted from the dictionary
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - kalakoa - 12-05-2012
Above has it correct: the sewage "problem" is just another manifestation of the "don't need no infrastructure" mentality that is so pervasive here.
On the grand scheme of things, though, at least sewage is "organic", unlike some of the other ways government lets individuals and/or corporations pollute the environment.
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - hawaiideborah - 12-05-2012
Waiopea, Wai'Opea, Wai Opea:
In the county and shoreline government documents I found the spelling most often to be Wai'Opea then Waiopea and last Wai Opea. on the link to the sign at the tide pools there are 2 different ways of writing the name on the same sign (Wai'Opea and Waiopea). Just like many other Hawaiian words and names, there is more than one way to spell it.
I agree that this is not a problem that is going to voluntarily be fixed. When I lived on Vashon Island in Puget Sound the government upgraded building codes from cesspools to septic systems. Then they went further. Whenever a house was sold it had to pass Dept. of Health inspection, which mandated septic systems and would not pass inspection with cesspool. Every time a property sold, it had to be switched from cesspool to septic. It was slow, but it has been steady, and enforced.
I understand the burden it puts on the current homeowner to voluntarily spend money to switch from cesspool to septic. I agree that unless the govt. steps in and forces this change the cesspools will remain.
The tide pools are officially named Wai ‘Opae Tidepools Marine Life Conservation District. Since they are a Marine Life Conservation District, wouldn't the State govt. have rules governing waste water sewage pouring into the State of Hawaii Marine Conservation District? Does anyone know how this designation of the Marine Conservation District regulates sewage dumping?
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - Bullwinkle - 12-05-2012
Since the Hawaiian language had no written form besides what we see in glyphs ...... would spelling of the words then just be a phonetic guess in the eye of the beholder? (am always fascinated with it - my engineers brain keeps looking for that cheat sheet with all the exceptions)
Ponds - Interesting this has gone on so long - I think it wont get resolved until a federal agency comes in and threatens action, may be the case behind the scenes as we type - EPA and Fish and Wildlife (just two federal agencies that may have an issue with this that come to mind).....having a long arm.
So sad as a relatively minor fix - 10-15% of the properties value - would result in such a large payoff - vaulting the places to world class values instead of being encumbered in the 3rd world water pollution issues it is dealing with today.
I didnt swim off the beach in Cartagena either, same issues - the hotels pump into the bay. (or did when I was traveling through)
sad........ imho
I
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - csgray - 12-05-2012
When the missionaries created the Hawaiian alphabet they created a fairly standardized spelling for Hawaiian words. Because this was fairly recent there hasn't been a whole lot of the grammatical drift that happens over time. This is why there are modern Hawaiian speakers who can translate old newspapers from Hawaiian to English.
I do think the feds are who will finally put the hammer down on all cesspools near the ocean, it may take time though. I lived in an unincorporated area on the outskirts of a fairly large town or small city, most of the lots were a third to half an acre and everyone was on septic. We were all forced to hook up to sewer lines at a high per foot cost, because the EPA came in with much more benign test results on ground water pollution than those being found in Kapoho. It really is a matter of when, not if. The feds may be hanging back waiting to see what happens locally and will step in now that a voluntary solution has been rejected. The folks in Vacationland seem to be trying to do the right thing in a way that doesn't bankrupt people, I hope they don't get forced into a more expensive fix because the people in Beach Lots don't want to make the investment in what are largely investment properties.
Carol
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - Bullwinkle - 12-05-2012
I agree the missionaries brought the christian alphabet. Beckwith (sp?) also had to include the adam and eve story in her landmark Hawaiian Mythology - the prime star trek (and anthropologists) "prime directive" violated oh so often here on the isles.
Ponds: What I have seen the feds do in the past is offer a carrot - local resolution - everything flies as long as it is up to code when the review comes down.
and a stick - a big heavy aimless club - that broadly paints and beats every one into one level of compliance or be bulldozed over - sometimes literally.
The Feds love to manage an example out of a issue .... lots of media brownie points in cleaning up e.coli, as american as apple pie.............
all indications the carrot may be in play, and I have yet to find that spelling (edit) cheat sheet...........
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - pahoated - 12-05-2012
quote:
Originally posted by rainyjim
It's called composting like mark mentioned
(and way to go mark for composting - definitely the most enviro-responsible waste management)
No one is going to be burying trash in the land of rocks...especially if they are to lazy to take it into the transfer station, the amount of work it would take to bury it would be so much more!
I hope we never meet. You stink.
Cheers
rainyjim
Are you serious that you are saying an open latrine pit is a compost pile? Do you not know how cholera starts?
As for the low lifers not burying trash, it would be easy to take several pictures around Seaview where people are not only burying trash in their yard, they have rubbish burning open pits.
It seems you have an attachment to open pit latrines, so it's much more likely you stink way worse than me. BTW, good job on the psychoschizo sign off, fling some poo, makes it all good, cheers!
RE: Kapoho Wai Opea tide pools Champagne pond sewage - Kelena - 12-05-2012
Carol: Scrotum water? Now there's some poetry for you. I think that might cut down on visitors so maybe we should rename it! But seriously, thank you for delving into that. Interesting!
But I think we SHOULD start calling it Wai 'opala: Trashy water.
As for it's actual name, I think the pronunciation is key. "Opea" and "Opae" make two different sounds (oh-pay-uh vs. oh-pa-ay). I think it is why-ee-oh-PA-ay. I googled it (yeah, stopped being lazy and used da google) and I think the correct way to spell it is: Wai‘#332;pae. Places named after water, like Waikiki, sometimes get the water (wai) smushed together with the descriptive word that follows. That would be a mere variation in orthography and not pronunciation whereas "Opea" vs. "Opae" would result in two distinct pronunciations. I yield to those who know better on this as I am just an interested beginner. But I think it is wai opae (add diacritical marks where needed). Is it any wonder the problem is so intractable? People can't even agree on what to call the place!
Turning to the merits, as we say, this is simply too expensive a fix for the homeowners. While within reach of some, it is probably not within reach of all. I have not researched the answer to the question of rules governing sewage pouring into a conservation district and am too busy to do that right now. So, speaking in broader and more general terms, the creation of a conservation district would be intended to conserve what is there. This, however, is not Hanauma Bay (I really gotta get there some day). It is a place that was already polluted. And it would be fundamentally unfair, and perhaps even an inverse condemnation or an improper and expensive taking of propety, to require property owners to clean a place up to conservation district maintenance levels. That is to say, the pollution may be grandfathered in in a sense (although not explicitly so). Perhaps there should be some sort of gradual condemnation process as the properties are alienated (sold).
Everyone agrees the pollution is a problem. Everyone agrees it needs to be resolved. The homeowners refuse to resolve it voluntarily, although they are doing a very good job of making it a better place than it would be without their efforts. The government needs to step in and address the problem. There needs to be a retrofit, and money is the only issue. Who will pay? All of us, I think, which is appropriate as we all use it. It would be worth it to have this resource.
Perhaps we should see what Mr. Ilagan has to say about all of this.