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+--- Thread: Setting the record straight (/showthread.php?tid=17549)
RE: Setting the record straight - Punatic007 - 08-21-2016
quote:
Originally posted by Midnight Rambler
The overthrow and annexation were obviously overwhelmingly opposed by Hawaiians, but once it became clear that things weren't going back, many of them backed statehood as the only hope of having a voice. The territorial government continued the oligarchic system where the Big Five ran the islands.
Myth.
RE: Setting the record straight - Midnight Rambler - 08-21-2016
Probably a fairly significant number of those who weren't registered were older people who had come here from Asia during the plantation era and never became citizens, and so weren't eligible to vote.
quote:
Originally posted by Punatic007
[quote]
Myth.
Now there's a compelling argument!
RE: Setting the record straight - pahoated - 08-21-2016
The myth trying to be perpetrated here is that the vote for statehood was some happy group hug all the way around. It wasn't, that is a fact, get over it.
Also, don't think the use of AJA by the bigots on PW are going unnoticed.
*Japanese tourist on bus through Pahoa, "Is this still America?*
RE: Setting the record straight - Punatic007 - 08-21-2016
Ted why don't you attempt to prove your point with facts as opposed to insults and sweeping generalizations?
This is a classic example of how myths are perpetuated, people can't let go of misconceptions even when the hard facts don't support their perceptions and arguments.
What part of the fact that the kingdom was completely bankrupted, came to the US government for help and then overwhelmingly VOTED for statehood is so hard to understand?
RE: Setting the record straight - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 08-21-2016
The myth trying to be perpetrated here is that the vote for statehood was some happy group hug all the way around.
The other myth is that a large number of Hawaiians did not vote in the election as a protest, or were prevented from voting in some way, or were tricked into not voting.
Question #1: Do you think the outcome would have been different if more people voted? I don't.
Question #2: Were there disgruntled voters at the time of the statehood election, even today? Yes.
Bonus Question: Name one election in history that did not have a small, medium, or large group of people upset about the outcome.
Bonus Bumper Sticker: Don't Blame Me, I Voted For ________.
- Be pleasant to inefficient workers; give them undeserved promotions. - Work slowly. - Refer all matters to committees for "further study and consideration. - Hold conferences. - Make travel as inconvenient as possible. - Haggle over precise wordings of communications. - Advocate “caution.” Be “reasonable” and avoid haste. (Excerpts from the WWII OSS Simple Sabotage Manual)
RE: Setting the record straight - Lee M-S - 08-21-2016
I think part of the problem here is two different (though related) events happened:
1) annexation 1893-1897-ish. I think we can all agree that native Hawaiians were against this.
2) statehood vote 1959. It seems to me that the choice was between being governed from the outside, or forming a state and having a say in your own government. Seems like statehood would be the lesser of two evils.
><(((*< ... ><(("< ... ><('< ... >o>
RE: Setting the record straight - bananahead - 08-21-2016
a lot of misinfo here.. this was 1959.. 6 years before I was born, not 1859..... dont be a dumbkook and say the locals didnt know what voting was... back then they, the ones that cared, were all for it! ...now the newer generation of activists have somewhat brainwashed the very old to jump on their bandwagon, but 56 years ago, it was a high % that were 100% behind statehood...
******************************************************************
save our indigenous and endemic Hawaiian Plants... learn about them, grow them, and plant them on your property, ....instead of all that invasive non-native garbage I see in most yards... aloha
RE: Setting the record straight - Punatic007 - 08-21-2016
quote:
Originally posted by dakine
TedPunatic007 why don't you attempt to prove your point with facts as opposed to insults and sweeping generalizations?
Try read the opening post.
RE: Setting the record straight - Punatic007 - 08-21-2016
quote:
Originally posted by Lee M-S
I think part of the problem here is two different (though related) events happened:
1) annexation 1893-1897-ish. I think we can all agree that native Hawaiians were against this.
2) statehood vote 1959. It seems to me that the choice was between being governed from the outside, or forming a state and having a say in your own government. Seems like statehood would be the lesser of two evils.
><(((*< ... ><(("< ... ><('< ... >o>
1) No we don't agree. Yes the sons of the missionaries lobbied in their self interests/profits and attempted to mislead and confuse everyone during annexation however the US government has been nothing but stellar and supportive from day one.
RE: Setting the record straight - Lee M-S - 08-21-2016
so you're saying that native Hawaiians were pro-annexation in the 1890s?
quote:
Originally posted by Punatic007
quote:
Originally posted by Lee M-S
I think part of the problem here is two different (though related) events happened:
1) annexation 1893-1897-ish. I think we can all agree that native Hawaiians were against this.
1) No we don't agree. Yes the sons of the missionaries lobbied in their self interests/profits and attempted to mislead and confuse everyone during annexation however the US government has been nothing but stellar and supportive from day one.
><(((*< ... ><(("< ... ><('< ... >o>