+- Punaweb Forum (http://punaweb.org/forum)
+-- Forum: Punaweb Forums (http://punaweb.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: Punatalk (http://punaweb.org/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=10)
+--- Thread: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition (/showthread.php?tid=15831)
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - kalakoa - 05-07-2015
The reason why reservations didn't work out as the Native Americans had hoped is because they implemented western culture into the reservations instead of restricting its adoption within the reservations.
In much the same way, DHHL will lease land back to the Native Hawaiians for purposes of building a western home.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - opihikao - 05-08-2015
FYI:
Apparently, construction will NOT start up again on Monday, May 11, 2015. It is my understanding there are still some legal issues to be addressed. No link, thus, JMO.
It would behoove TMT to inform the public what their plans are, and gain support in order to proceed with construction. Gaining the public trust is paramount to their success. The Governor and his minions need to assist TMT in this effort, especially with the protestors. I know, some of us really don't trust government either, however, Ige needs to step it up! Threats of arrest mean nothing to some.
TMT alone does not have enough "public trust", given the actions of late (past few months). Additionally, money to schools already spent (by TMT) is not grounds for "trust", nor is any "future promises made" grounds for trust. We've all been disappointed with broken promises from huge developments before.
At least my ohana up there knows to stay the hell away from any TMT equipment (ie. bulldozers, excavators, 120,000lb. "rock crushers", etc.) for more than one reason.
Have a good weekend all.
JMO.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PunaMauka2 - 05-08-2015
i would ask exactly how is TMT supposed to go about gaining this "public trust", but then what exactly has "TMT" done to lose this public trust in the first place? and what are these "actions of late (past few months)".
also, by "public trust" are we talking truly about the community at large or a very vocal activist minority up on the mountain?
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 05-08-2015
TMT alone does not have enough "public trust", given the actions of late (past few months).
Do you have an example of this ophikao?
My understanding is that the construction was going to proceed according to schedule, and that all of the permits and paperwork were properly filed and accepted (all available to the public for review). I'm sure the protestors didn't like being arrested while blocking the road, but the TMT entities didn't do that, it was the police. If the protestors break the law first, it's hard to understand how that might be a reason they have had their trust in the TMT broken. (?)
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Rob Tucker - 05-08-2015
opihikao,
Can you offer any explanation for why the observatory on Kilauea is not an issue?
Very curious.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - opihikao - 05-08-2015
quote:Aloha HOTPE, yes, several. First one posted here on 4/16:
Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge
TMT alone does not have enough "public trust", given the actions of late (past few months).
Do you have an example of this ophikao?
My understanding is that the construction was going to proceed according to schedule, and that all of the permits and paperwork were properly filed and accepted (all available to the public for review). I'm sure the protestors didn't like being arrested while blocking the road, but the TMT entities didn't do that, it was the police. If the protestors break the law first, it's hard to understand how that might be a reason they have had their trust in the TMT broken. (?)
http://punaweb.org/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19779&whichpage=39&SearchTerms=TMT
1) The day I went to Mauna Kea, which was also during the Governor's hiatus of this project being Merrie Monarch week, one of the TMT officials acted like a "tourist" to get past the protestors/protectors. He admitted he was doing work for the past "few days" although the media and public were advised of the moratorium until April 20, 2015. I watched it happen. There are videos of the discussion between the TMT official and the "protectors" flooding the internet (they tape EVERYTHING). In essence, the Governor's/State ruling meant nothing to this man.
Second, during the hiatus, machines moved (at 2am), work done for several days (same timeframe; hiatus ordered by Gov.), and confrontation occurred due to perceived "promise broken". Not to mention, hiatus ordered by the Governor.
The meetings that have been held, and continue to be held, need to be productive, not just giving lip service, on both sides. Yes, permits are issued, so start construction. Arrest all who dare try to break the law (which law? US law, of course. Some are not held to US law in their minds).
However, the perception of deceit given the examples above, is the problem. Just say, "We're gonna do it (DATE), so be advised, we will keep you informed as we progress." DONE. Let the chips fall where they may.
Mr. Tucker, in short, no (re: Kilauea observatory). I maintain, this TMT opposition is not about TMT. This is about the overthrow of the Hawaiian Kingdom, and Mauna Kea has given this issue a huge platform.
JMO.
ETA: typo
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 05-08-2015
Do you know the name of the TMT official, and his title/position?
What type of machines were moved, how many of them, and what work ensued? Are there photos, because if it was site prep, a photo would clearly show the position of the vehicles, and how they changed the terrain. Or were these vehicles at the visitor center, and repositioned while waiting for the moratorium to end?
Added: sorry I didn't see a link to the discussion with the TMT official, so maybe it's stated in there. Do you happen to have a link to that?
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - 2liveque - 05-08-2015
Interesting stance Opihikao. No wonder you are loved on Punaweb.
Interesting that you would advocate to "let the cards fall where they may," imploring Ige to arrest anyone who stands in the way. Again, no wonder you are so loved on this dear Puna forum.
Like it would be that easy to simply arrest folks. When will it stop? Remember, the first 31 is just the start. There will be 31 more...and 31 more...and 31 more. Where does it stop? Arrest 1,000 Kanakas? Most folks over the age of 40 do not realize how powerful social media and the age of information is. It has been the great neutralizer that has allowed this current battle to move further than any one in recent history.
And yes, Ige, The visitor industry, construction industry, real estate would just LOVE to have images of Hawaiians being arrested being broadcast to the world. Easy for older, captured generations to brush this one off as no big deal. This will prove to be the fatal flaw of the empire. Play that violin while the walls crumble. It's easier to not think of the inevitable.
The current generation up on the Mauna says..."go 'ahead. Make our day. Arrest us with all of your glory." Keep arresting us and see how far this takes you. Again, this is not an easy decision for Ige. Don't make it out to be so simple. And if you still do, then you are living in a bubble.
Things are falling apart for the empire that be. Don't let it be used to scare you. Let it be used to guide you. Stay tuned.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PunaMauka2 - 05-08-2015
stay tuned...the stage is set on the lofty platform in the sky for the opening act to return the Kingdom from the grip of the evil empire. will the empire strike back?
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-08-2015
Are you getting a good wifi signal up there dakine?