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+--- Thread: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July (/showthread.php?tid=21045)
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RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - kalakoa - 07-20-2019
Ceded lands were not theirs (US) to give
It's all just words. WIll Gabbard or Sanders or Green sponsor some legislation to return the land to its "rightful" owners? No?
I have some other stupid questions:
Will forcing TMT off the mountain cause the Hawaiians to magically receive homestead leases from DHHL?
Who is ultimately liable for damage to existing telescopes due to lack of maintenance?
If all the haoles leave, what will the Hawaiians do for money? Are they ready and willing to return to farming, hunting, gathering?
Letting the Hawaiians build campsites and block roads violates the "rule of law", and the State seems to be going along with it. Can non-Hawaiians also enjoy these liberties? What if the camp was in downtown Hilo?
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - kalakoa - 07-20-2019
Forgot one: if a tour operator goes out of business due to lack of access, do they get a bailout, or just lose their livelihood? "Business hostile" indeed!
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - glinda - 07-20-2019
Are they ready and willing to return to farming, hunting, gathering?
Like I said, very entertaining. Considering I do not think many have ever stopped. It's a way of life, all over the islands. Maybe not on your side, but look around, you'd be surprised.
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - MattKarma - 07-20-2019
quote:
Originally posted by kalakoa
Ceded lands were not theirs (US) to give
It's all just words. WIll Gabbard or Sanders or Green sponsor some legislation to return the land to its "rightful" owners? No?
I have some other stupid questions:
Will forcing TMT off the mountain cause the Hawaiians to magically receive homestead leases from DHHL?
Who is ultimately liable for damage to existing telescopes due to lack of maintenance?
If all the haoles leave, what will the Hawaiians do for money? Are they ready and willing to return to farming, hunting, gathering?
Letting the Hawaiians build campsites and block roads violates the "rule of law", and the State seems to be going along with it. Can non-Hawaiians also enjoy these liberties? What if the camp was in downtown Hilo?
...and what will the SYFY channel do without the (free) pretty pictures?
***Still can't figure out how to spell 'car' correctly***
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - ironyak - 07-20-2019
@Frank - not legitimately owned according to whom and by what standard? Or for comparison, any more or less legitimately owned than by Kamehameha I between 1790 and 1819?
@kalakoa - Try a Ctrl-F on the State Constitution for haoles, telescope owners, or tour operators to check for related special provisions (rights are for everyone right?)
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 07-20-2019
what will the Hawaiians do for money? Are they ready and willing to return to farming, hunting, gathering?
Perhaps glinda can contact his vast network of self de-terminators, or DHHL, and ask if he and his friends can use a tract of land on a trial basis, a temporary practice ground for farming, hunting and gathering. Nat Geo or Discovery Channel could sponsor them for a series, ‘To Kingdom Come!’ and after a period of time struggling for identity, growing a crop of taro, and bringing down feral pigs, they might then weigh in on a plan for the kind of future they’d prefer. I farmed for years so I know many would be successful. But I also know it’s not for everyone.
Thanks for the link ironyak. Good to see the events on the mountain today.
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - Kaimana - 07-20-2019
I can't believe how bigoted some of your are.
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - kalakoa - 07-20-2019
But I also know it's not for everyone.
A restored Kingdom might need all of its subjects to farm/hunt/gather in order to feed everyone. Especially without modern equipment and techniques.
Who are "the" Hawaiians anyway? Some protest TMT, others support it. None of them seem concerned about other forms of desecration going on, they tolerate being denied homesteads, wear t-shirts, carry cell phones. Their outrage is very conveniently limited to certain specific projects.
Mind you, I'm not saying they don't have a point, I just really question the strategies being used.
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - kalakoa - 07-20-2019
I can't believe how bigoted some of your are.
I had never experienced racism before moving here.
Nor have I ever seen such selective enforcement of the laws.
Maybe I can get me some of those Kingdom license plates. Might as well.
RE: TMT construction begins Monday 15 July - glinda - 07-20-2019
I had never experienced racism before moving here...
Ah, but you've seen examples of it perpetrated on others all your life. Black, brown, whatever. Yet here you found it involves white. Well welcome to the real world. And what about it, in any way, represents all the people? All Hawaiians?
Nah, racism here, in the islands, and don't get me wrong it is here in spades, but still it has a lot a lot more to do with what's in your heart than otherwise. Because, when you open it you find there's an amazing amount of aloha too.