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+--- Thread: HPP road fees (/showthread.php?tid=21624)
RE: HPP road fees - Rob Tucker - 03-28-2020
As I recall the original bond occurred at a point in time where asphalt paving was running around $80k per mile. Just about as the ink dried on that deal the price of oil shot up and paving did too.... to about $250k per mile.
Considering that at this moment in time oil prices are in the twenties it seems like ab excellent time (or soon will be) to get back into the paving activity again.
Just an outside observation.
RE: HPP road fees - kalakoa - 03-28-2020
You guys are still bickering about this and expecting something to change?
Please seek professional help instead of whinging on a pseudonymous forum.
RE: HPP road fees - mermaid53 - 03-28-2020
Considering that at this moment in time oil prices are in the twenties it seems like ab excellent time (or soon will be) to get back into the paving activity again.
That would be the plan except a director is suing the Association and 2 directors at the moment and cancelling ALL meetings obstructing all HPP business....i.e. road paving. Lawsuits are expensive.
You guys are still bickering about this and expecting something to change?
Actually this thread started out with an innocent suggestion that the road fees be frozen during the pandemic.
RE: HPP road fees - Chunkster - 03-28-2020
Obie is correct about debt service. I was there when the men from the bond company did a presentation to the HPP members on what taking on that obligation entailed. Measures to protect the bond holders in addition to keeping the payments current include holding required levels of cash reserves and mandatory collection enforcement in the form liens and foreclosures.
Those bond officials also kindly gave their assessment of where the money should be spent, i.e. the roads with the highest maintenance costs. The board that took out the loan and several succeeding boards ignored that advice by a combination of good old boy favoritism and a bizarre plan to pave every sixth road so "everybody will be close to a paved road they can drive across HPP on." Problem was that hardly anyone other than board members does that. Most people just commute to Hilo
So here we are in the middle of a pandemic killing tens of thousands of people and bringing the world to the brink of economic ruin, and we (myself included) have nothing better to do in our isolation but wrangle over the insoluble mess that is HPP. I wish the judge would declare receivership soon, but I'm not hopeful. If he or she does, they should appoint outside adult supervision and forbid anyone who has had a position of authority in the last 20 years from even speaking to the new boss. They have proven themselves stubbornly incapable of getting along or getting anything constructive done.
RE: HPP road fees - leo - 03-28-2020
There's some truth to what you said Chunkster but I think its unfair to make a blanket statement about all directors. I've seen some good ones then and now.
I find some of these posts educational. Why the bond for instance is a secret? What's up with that? That mentality is where the dysfunction lies. Why are some board of directors so resistant to transparency? I personally don't mind reading some of these posts. To each his own. Two directors want to defer the road fees is a positive gesture and they get tongue lashed by the same renegades.
RE: HPP road fees - Chunkster - 03-28-2020
" . . . and they get attacked by the same renegades." - leo
You seem like someone who consistently wants real transparency, and that's good, but can't you see that your last statement is part of the problem? There is "us" and then there's those nasty others, aka "renegades." I know my suggestion to exclude all the former "leaders" seems extreme, and yes, there were a few good ones . . . very few. Problem is that most of the better ones who tried to be civil and get along with others have walked away due to the toxic atmosphere that just never seems to get better. The only real solution is for the county to take responsibility for all these tax cash cow subdivisions they allowed to be created in violation of their own laws, but I don't see that happening in my lifetime. In the meantime, the judge needs to take it completely out of our hands.
RE: HPP road fees - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 03-28-2020
... at this moment in time oil prices are in the twenties it seems like ab excellent time... to get back into the paving activity again.
Thanks Rob, that's true.
When the original bond was signed a favorable price was also negotiated with the paving company. They would work at a reduced rate whenever they had no other projects. Not only are oil prices incredibly low right now, people are out of work. It might be an ideal time for a functioning board (if people allow it to function) to negotiate a contract at a discount rate with the pavers.
That is, if everybody paid their road dues which would put money in the HPPOA checking account, and if people weren't suing each other and preventing one board or another from functioning. Then contacts could be signed and materials purchased cheaply. We might get twice as much paving completed for the same amount of money as was possible last year when prices were higher.
The people who complain that their road isn't paved so won't pay their road maintenance fee, and the people who in one way the other obstruct a functioning board, might be the same HPP residents who prevent their own streets from getting pavement.
For your consideration.
Full disclosure: my road is paved, I paid my road bill, I knew the person (my neighbor) who signed the original paving contracts and I spoke with him about it on multiple occasions.
RE: HPP road fees - leo - 03-28-2020
Problem is that most of the better ones who tried to be civil and get along with others have walked away due to the toxic atmosphere that just never seems to get better.
Not to knock those that walked away. That's probably why the toxic atmosphere escalated. I don't think turning your back is going to solve anything. The two directors have moxy and kudos to them for sticking it out. Hope they can get back to work soon.
RE: HPP road fees - Obie - 03-28-2020
The two directors created the toxic atmosphere that caused the rest of the board to resign.
That's not moxie.
RE: HPP road fees - leo - 03-28-2020
quote:Five against two?!!! You think people are stupid? That's your ridiculous spin cycle. That board was the worst board I've ever seen. We're better off with them gone. The two directors have moxy. I saw it first hand at members meetings and board of directors meetings. Like I said I hope they can get back to work soon.
Originally posted by Obie
The two directors created the toxic atmosphere that caused the rest of the board to resign.
That's not moxie.
Why don't we get back to the topic now Obie? Road fees.