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+--- Thread: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition (/showthread.php?tid=15831)
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PunaMauka2 - 05-21-2015
Despite Mauna Kea pause, work continues on Thirty Meter Telescope
http://www.staradvertiser.com/news/breaking/20150520_despite_mauna_kea_pause_work_continues_on_thirty_meter_telescope.html?id=304505781
good news!
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"Canada joins California Institute of Technology, the University of California, and the science institutions of China, India, and Japan as partners in the effort to build one of the largest and most powerful optical telescopes in the world, expected to become operational in 2024."
i really appreciate the international aspect of this project. even better considering some of the partners in this project tend to have friction or rivalry elsewhere in their relations. i find international cooperation in the pursuit of knowledge beyond the scope of our planet to be very agreeable. and i am rather thrilled that we can have the honor of hosting this cutting edge project of exploration here on our very own Hawai'i Island.
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“Canada is proud to be an official partner in this revolutionary facility that has the potential to transform our understanding of the universe,” federal Industry Minister James Moore said in a statement.
Most of the money will be spent in Canada, creating high-tech jobs in the telescope’s construction and assembly, according to the prime minister’s office. The investment will also ensure a viewing share for Canadian researchers once the telescope is up and working."
certainly a fair return on investment. and good to see people benefiting from this project wherever they may be.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Guest - 05-21-2015
Great posts Opihikao. Thank you for the links of the speakers at the meeting in Laupahoehoe.
The work on the Tmt continues around the world, they have also hired on PR to help handle the escalating situation. Millions will continue to be spent to push this project through, as many countries stand to save billions over the next few decades if the project is completed atop Maunakea. Paul Coleman touched on this during his speech when he stated its easier and cheaper to drive up to the summit to work on or fix something on the TMT, than space telescopes( obviously ). Jmo, The penny in comparison donation for island education is a tax write off and a slap in the face to island keiki sacrificing some of their maunakea, rich history,and culture.
Hotpe, most east side big business hire locally like Walmart, target, and home depot ( real jobs). Also The largest donations currently given to the east side of the big island comes from the american government( tax payer money), not without a heavy dose of stigma attached. The Tmt donations as you call them are small in comparison to all that is at stake for the native people from hawaii, jmo.
P.S. I was under the assumption that the telescopes (time) atop maunakea could be used from other locations like the university. So when I mentioned kids from local area public schools having opportunities to use the now proposed decommissioned telescopes atop maunakea? I was visualizing kids in their classrooms or hilo university being able to study and learn from the telescopes from afar, not up on the mauna. My bad because its impossible to happen with the current state of the art computers in these public school classrooms and the science technology today, right?.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 05-21-2015
a heavy dose of stigma attached. The Tmt donations as you call them are small in comparison to all that is at stake for the native people from hawaii, jmo.
It's been said the protests are not about the TMT, so there's no stigma attached to the donations, and nothing at stake in accepting the money.
I mentioned kids from local area public schools having opportunities to use the now proposed decommissioned telescopes atop maunakea
Decommissioned means everything is shut down, dismantled, hardware, software, computer support facilities in Hilo or Waimea, and in the specific case of Mauna Kea observatories the request has been to reuse those platforms/foundations for new telescopes, or return the sites to their natural state. What would the keiki look at?
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - kalakoa - 05-21-2015
big business hire locally like Walmart, target, and home depot
Except for the part where they bring in off-island labor to erect the building. (I realize this isn't "all big business", but those guys are still standing out in front of Walgreen's...)
the assumption that the telescopes (time) atop maunakea could be used from other locations like the university ... impossible to happen with the current state of the art computers in these public school classrooms
Yes: the university has both computers and broadband. Public schools often lack one or the other, but at least they're eligible for public funding of these (at inflated prices through well-connected "consultants"). Charter schools have to make do with what they can scrounge up. Yet somehow they will all have STEM programs to feed "qualified applicants" to those high-paying engineering jobs at TMT.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - PaulW - 05-21-2015
" we will be moving to the mainland eventually for the same reasons too"
So now we see why gypsy69 is against investment in Hawaii, he/she/it is planning to leave anyway.
It wouldn't be necessary if there was sufficient investment, but you're against that out of pure spite.
I hope your kids grow up to get a better education than you.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Tink - 05-21-2015
It's a shame in my eyes that the unions on this island do not take advantage of a project like TMT to stand up and demand that the jobs go to their union first, with an aggressive apprenticeship program to take our youth and train them for a good career, before off island labor is used to fill in the rest of the needed workforce.
It is also a shame in my eyes that the Building Department does not have someone qualified to inspect the actual structure, which by rules they would be the ones to provide this, and that a "special inspector" has to be brought in to perform that duty if this is the case. Sure, welding on steel requires an "onsite" inspector with the proper credentials, as each weld has to be inspected, and staffing by a jurisdiction usually can not spare a person to be there full time.
CMU, or concrete masonry unit (block walls) only require a reinforcing steel and inner cell cleanliness inspection every "lift", or 4 feet, and a subsequent grout (structural mortar fill), easy in my eyes and current staffing should be able to handle this although what I have seen what the current staffing has passed has me wonder sometimes. Must have the attitude if it is union done, it must be right so where's the card to sign while we talk story. Shameful.
So with that, there is where some of the "trickle down" should go to us little people to provide a future for our Keiki, and strength and pride in our island.
Community begins with Aloha
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Guest - 05-21-2015
This TMT project planned atop maunakea is not uniting our diversafied community, or really going to enrich our quality of life. It is our American governments part of the continued space race that had America walk on the moon (first?). Sure hope the TMT project does not include the same amount of TNT dynamite blasting that the Chilean site needed for the worlds 1st or 2nd largest telescope to perch?
The tons of rock blown up or clouds of dust caused from the TNT blasts were made for live t.v. around the world. The mountaintop in Chile has now been reshaped 30 feet lower in elevation to fit one of mans made future wonders of the world. In my opinion, Maunakea and its important history is worth protection from this type of manmade destruction. If they use hundreds of pounds of tnt dynamite to blow up some of Maunakea's history or light blocking cinder cones for the site of the Tmt, will we be able to watch the clouds of red dust on oceanic t.v or would it even be mentioned?.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 05-21-2015
The tons of rock blown up or clouds of dust caused from the TNT ...The mountaintop in Chile has now been reshaped 30 feet lower in elevation... If they use hundreds of pounds of tnt dynamite to blow up some of Maunakea's history or light blocking cinder cones for the site of the Tmt, will we be able to watch the clouds of red dust on oceanic t.v or would it even be mentioned?.
Oceanic? What you described is a scene from the next Mad Max movie
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - MattKarma - 05-21-2015
Mauna Kea; We're thinking much too small. We should be blowing up Everest. Think how many mountain climber lives that would save.
RE: We Support TMT - Please sign the petition - Wao nahele kane - 05-21-2015
Just use a concrete block slab foundation poured over a membrane linked via galvanized steal pins. When decommissioned, cut the pins and use a crane to lift out the individual block slabs with no impact of the original grade after removing the membrane. Use the same practice for driveways and parking pads.
That ought to put an end to the damn bickering.
ETA... The batch plants will love that idea too.