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+--- Thread: HPP road maintainence (/showthread.php?tid=17721)
RE: HPP road maintainence - Eric1600 - 05-19-2017
Originally posted by mermaid53
Base coarse is good under asphalt, for your gardens and is not user friendly for vehicles, bike riding and pedestrians. Road material is not all created equal. I've often heard 3/4" minus is a better grade road material. Maybe someone out there who knows about road material can comment further on this. But please don't ask for base coarse :/
Base course is way too dusty. Cinders are better but expensive. Drain rock 3/4" is good too.
I've found filling in pot holes with 1-1/2" drain rock to be the most effective way to keep them from coming back. The larger rock doesn't wash out or get pushed out by cars driving fast. It's a little rougher ride over the filled holes, but way better than pot holes.
RE: HPP road maintainence - kalakoa - 05-19-2017
a lot of people are asking for "base coarse" on their roads bc they have none
Sounds like people are asking for the "road maintenance" that they paid for.
RE: HPP road maintainence - mermaid53 - 05-19-2017
I've found filling in pot holes with 1-1/2" drain rock to be the most effective way to keep them from coming back. The larger rock doesn't wash out or get pushed out by cars driving fast. It's a little rougher ride over the filled holes, but way better than pot holes.
So it sounds like you've found base coarse to be a good band aid fix for potholes. You're right, a side effect of base coarse is dust, a 2nd reason base coarse shouldn't be used for road material. Consider riding on a mile of road w/that material, and consider if this was laid on all the unpaved cross roads in HPP. It would be even worse for pedestrians and bikes. Someone on my road tried cement to fill a pothole.
Something similar if not the same as base coarse, was laid on some DE roads of Makuu back in early 2014. Angry lot owners from one of those roads got a petition together demanding the GM scrape that "crap" off the road and lay down good road material. They were so angry they were demanding the GM's and board Pres's resignation. The crew pretty much removed it but before the job could get finished, the GM was fired. One of those lot owners showed up at the recent mtg politely requesting the board fulfill the request. The GM told him he has a lot of work orders and the lot owner's time would come soon. They were over budget on road material. (But coming sooner is more CS roads?)
After discussion w/an Oahu friend a few yrs ago, (an international geological engineer consultant, UH professor, and author of university text book, "Soil Improvement and Ground Modifications Methods) and his checking out what was on our roads, said that it's best to pay more up front for good road material as it will last a lot longer. That what we had on our roads was good under asphalt or in the garden...it was not "road material". Going cheap, or using bad quality road material will end up wasting money instead of saving money. He suggested getting proctor tests as part of our routine road material purchasing process.
May be time to revive the Road Committee who was on the brink of doing test roads w/diff combos of road material in 2014, before the employee firings. The board that followed and in control of our roads for 3 yrs now had no interest in continuing that committee. Look where we are today. We've gone backwards, not forward.
RE: HPP road maintainence - leo - 05-21-2017
May be time to revive the Road Committee who was on the brink of doing test roads w/diff combos of road material in 2014, before the employee firings. The board that followed and in control of our roads for 3 yrs now had no interest in continuing that committee. Look where we are today. We've gone backwards, not forward.
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Pretty unprofessional when you get a board that wastes time and money starting from square 1. Sounds like some of these road committees would be better off as membership committees that can't be removed with the whim of a new board each year.
RE: HPP road maintainence - Tink - 05-21-2017
Ya. Would be even better if someone on the road committee has actual experience/knowledge of road maintenence, as the average person may think "gravel is gravel, what's the difference?" And choose an unsuitable base due to only observing the cost per ton.
Community begins with Aloha
RE: HPP road maintainence - leo - 05-21-2017
There's lots of people in HPP with road knowledge. Wish they'd share their expertise. That'd mean butting heads with a general manager that doesn't like gravel roads and has tunnel vision. As time marches on, his inexperience is more evident by looking at the road conditions. Scraping and rolling only makes more dust and that seems to be his definition of road maintenance. Then you got Eric1600 here giving tips for pothole maintenance which seems off kilter being that's the general manager's job to maintain the roads. Just seemed kind of funny to me. But that's where's it's taken us because our general manager's not doing his job.
RE: HPP road maintainence - mermaid53 - 05-22-2017
Eric1600's not alone. There's a lot of people who can't take it anymore so are spending more of their own $ to fix the potholes.
Scraping and rolling is only a pothole band aid fix.
The lady I spoke about earlier in this thread decided in the end not to pay her road maint fee after paying for gravel and doing the labor herself on the potholes near her driveway. She's one of the 2,256 delinquent road fees = $707,256.00.
Would be even better if someone on the road committee has actual experience/knowledge of road maintenence, as the average person may think "gravel is gravel, what's the difference?" And choose an unsuitable base due to only observing the cost per ton
Tink, there were people who knew about roads involved on the Road Committee and there was hope that the right road material formula would be found. The committee was composed of the former GM, former Road Crew Supv, former HPP Engineer, a Viet Nam vet/HPP lot owner who built roads and airstrips while in the military, and guest: local quarry owner..Here's an excerpt from their last report in 2014:
"Discussion went from our original concept of testing the same type of materials from different quarries to testing different types of materials from one or two quarries.
We think that a road material with more fine particles, say cinder and dirt may lock together better than the standard base material or just plain cinders. We will also test a material formulated from ¾” base rock but without some of the very fine particles say under the #200 screen.
We deem it prudent to have a proctor test this material, so we can see how the compaction in the field is going. One of our problems may be our roller isn’t sufficient to compact the material and that a double drum roller may be needed. XXXX will be in charge of the proctor and testing.
XXXX is working on the formula for the new base material, and the cinder soil is a stock product from the XXXXX quarry. The balance in the cinder formula will be 90% cinder and 10% soil to start with. We can make adjustments from this base line. Water will be required during the installation of all materials.
Another possibility is using a sand/cinder mix. The initial problem with this mix is that it will be more expensive so we may use it as an alternative if the cinder/soil doesn’t meet our standards.
We plan on starting the installation of new test material in early July, starting with the ½ mile test area for each material."
RE: HPP road maintainence - Tink - 05-22-2017
Mahalo for your reply Mermaid 53. I based my comment due to the previous posts about inadequate base being applied, too thin a chip seal on loosely compacted base, etc.. Whatever happened to the results/recommendations from the testing done in 2014, and why, as it appears that no one has followed same?
As far as doing your own maintenence on the roads, has anyone ever challenged the mandatory fee by turning in their receipts for their road repairs with a check for the balance?
Community begins with Aloha
RE: HPP road maintainence - Hmmm - 05-22-2017
Let me share with you the scare tactics of not paying road maintenance fees...this is first hand experience ..i had not paid my road maintenance fees as I disagree with the way it is being spent.
After talking with county they said yea that means nothing unless you plan to sell...
I was back 2 years and they added another 500 to it for "lien fees" bwahahaha yea so I decided I would pay it off so I could have a voice to speak about our so called road maintenance and with assistance from some friends in pertinent places found there was never a lien on my property... also I requested a lien release and finally received one about 2 months after I requested it...it is the most generic looking paperwork I have seen ! It is basically a lien release signed off by the GM and notorized but there is nothing else to it...for the 500 they charged me I could have whipped that up and got it motorized within an hour...therefor my moral to my story is..forget the bogus scare tactics they are trying to use if ya don't agree with how they are spending our moneys..dont pay the dues!!!
RE: HPP road maintainence - Hmmm - 05-22-2017
Also yes Mermaid it would be wonderful to have a person that is knowledgeable running our road maintenance because what we have now is definitely not that!