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+--- Thread: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad (/showthread.php?tid=17696)
Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - DoryGray - 10-06-2016
An elderly (93) acquaintance of mine let a single woman move into her upstairs apartment on the verbal contract of barter (cooking, cleaning) for use of the apt. She did what she could re: got references and interview, but the woman has stopped doing any work. She's been told to move, but says she can't find another place. I'm trying to help this elderly woman who is being taken advantage of. I could serve an eviction notice or tell her the apt will be cleaned out in say 4 days & to move. I've talked to real estate friends & they are unclear about what to do. Can't get through to legal aid. Any suggestions?
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - opihikao - 10-06-2016
So sorry to hear this, DoryGray. Bless you for trying to help. Kupuna should not have to go through this.
Serve this person a five (5) day notice (form available online), and no excuses. "Can't find another place" is not the elderly person's problem. Verbal agreement is also binding, and hopefully, this doesn't end up in small claims court, or something. Just be firm, and give her five (5) days, serve her the document, and if she doesn't move, have her removed. I've been through this with an elderly person, and you must be firm. Taking advantage of Kupuna is one of the worst sins.
Can someone stay with her/him for this period to make sure she/he is safe? Surely, this person has family somewhere, if not here in Hawai'i. Each day that goes by for this Kupuna is unwarranted stress, and needs resolution.
In closing, there are also State funded programs that protect our elderly from abuse and exploitation, of any kind. Try that avenue, in conjunction with the five day notice. Here are some links for your perusal:
https://www.caregiver.org/hawaii-adult-protective-services-aps-and-elder-abuse-hotline
http://humanservices.hawaii.gov/ssd/home/adult-services/
http://www.elder-abuseca.com/stateResources/hawaii.html
Hope this helps. If there is anything that makes my blood boil, it is abuse (no matter if physical, financial, etc.) of Kupuna and Keiki. [
!]JMO.
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - Tink - 10-06-2016
Burns my britches to hear about this. I know the P.D. May not want to get involved, but maybe you could try the angle of filing a restraining order against the "renter" due to elder abuse, then call the cops to the address when she is there.
Community begins with Aloha
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - terracore - 10-06-2016
IMHO, there is no rental contract so your elderly acquaintance isn't a landlord. She has a guest turned squatter that won't leave. Next time she leaves the property, change the locks. Have all her crap boxed up and waiting for her when she returns. If she calls the police, invite them to come in and help her confirm none of her belongings are inside or let her remove anything that didn't get boxed up. But don't leave auntie by herself to deal with this derelict.
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - opihikao - 10-06-2016
quote:Totally agree, terracore. Good, sound advice.
Originally posted by terracore
IMHO, there is no rental contract so your elderly acquaintance isn't a landlord. She has a guest turned squatter that won't leave. Next time she leaves the property, change the locks. Have all her crap boxed up and waiting for her when she returns. If she calls the police, invite them to come in and help her confirm none of her belongings are inside or let her remove anything that didn't get boxed up. But don't leave auntie by herself to deal with this derelict.
Aloha, Tink, burns my britches, too. Hope all is well with you and your ohana.
JMO.
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - Carey - 10-06-2016
Unfortunately, a verbal work trade without lease is looked on in the courts as a regular month-to-month lease, with ALL of the eviction notice laws AND all work (even if not preformed) is taxable, so the renter can further complicate things...
Under these circumstances, many landowners find it easier to buy out the renter rather than undergo a dragged out eviction...
Here are some of the tenets rights docs from Hawaii:
TERMINATION
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/hawaii-notice-requirements-terminate-month-month-tenancy.html
Page 4 of this handbook explains word of mouth agreements, work in exchange & other stuff:
https://hilo.hawaii.edu/housing/offcampus/documents/landlord-tenant-handbook.pdf
Others:
http://www.courts.state.hi.us/self-help/landlord/tenant_claims
http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/HUD?src=/states/hawaii/renting/tenantrights
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/overview-landlord-tenant-laws-hawaii.html
https://www.landlordology.com/hawaii-landlord-tenant-laws/
http://law.justia.com/codes/hawaii/2011/division3/title28/chapter521
http://www.landlord.com/lawresoverview_hawaii.htm
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - Justin - 10-06-2016
Carey, that may be true, but I'm thinking someone working out a barter agreement with a 93 year old probably isn't fully up to speed on landlord-tenant laws. Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel confident on this one.
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - Tink - 10-07-2016
Aloha Opihikao, all is good for the most part, and hope you and your Ohana are good as well. 5 year old nephew broke his nose last weekend jumping on bed, then slammed his finger in the truck door after a follow up visit at the docs on Tuesday. He's doing somersaults now. Oh to be young and resilient!
Now, back to our regular programming....
Community begins with Aloha
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - Hawaii Bound - 10-07-2016
quote:
Originally posted by Justin
Carey, that may be true, but I'm thinking someone working out a barter agreement with a 93 year old probably isn't fully up to speed on landlord-tenant laws. Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel confident on this one.
I'm thinking the just the opposite. People like this typically knkow the law better than the attorneys do. It's how they make their living jumping from place to place taking advantage of people. They are just waiting for someone to slip up so they can sue them...and win.
RE: Removing a rental barter situation gone bad - BillyB - 10-07-2016
"Unfortunately, a verbal work trade without lease is looked on in the courts as a regular month-to-month lease, with ALL of the eviction notice laws AND all work (even if not preformed) is taxable, so the renter can further complicate things...
Under these circumstances, many landowners find it easier to buy out the renter rather than undergo a dragged out eviction...
Here are some of the tenets rights docs from Hawaii:
TERMINATION
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/hawaii-notice-requirements-terminate-month-month-tenancy.html
Page 4 of this handbook explains word of mouth agreements, work in exchange & other stuff:
https://hilo.hawaii.edu/housing/offcampus/documents/landlord-tenant-handbook.pdf
Others:
http://www.courts.state.hi.us/self-help/landlord/tenant_claims
http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/HUD?src=/states/hawaii/renting/tenantrights
http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/overview-landlord-tenant-laws-hawaii.html
https://www.landlordology.com/hawaii-landlord-tenant-laws/
http://law.justia.com/codes/hawaii/2011/division3/title28/chapter521
http://www.landlord.com/lawresoverview_hawaii.htm
Edited by - Carey on 10/06/2016 17:43:56 "
And then the people who wrote all these laws wring their hands about the lack of rental housing. The law views the old lady as a greedy landlord, exploiting the poor tenant.