Hawaii Business magazine

[Rob Tucker]

I think that the statement comes from the fact that despite HELCO having access to cheaper electricity they are allowed under the PUC to charge a rate based on the cost of oil. So there is a benefit to HELCO which is not passed on to we consumers. I think PGV gets something like 16 cents per kwh and they show a profit at that.

I could be wrong but that is my understanding.

[Bullwinkle]

not to worry - I am sure the insurance co's have the reserves in place to cover both types losses

- just like A.I.G. had the mortgage pools "covered" in case of melt down. Backed with federal approval,certification and oversight - not

In the case of individual homowners - they can indemnify themselves

In the case of geothermal breach - who has the reserves to indemnify those potential losses?

[Rob Tucker]

Billwinkle asked: "In the case of geothermal breach - who has the reserves to indemnify those potential losses?"

That is what the Puna Geothermal Relocation Fund is supposed to be for. Emily Naeole successfully had the fund changed to the Puna Geothermal Relocation and Community Benefit Fund and has since been spending the money on other things. While that may be all well and good the fund is required to maintain a minimum of $1 million. Naeole took that to mean a maximum of $1 million and everything above that figure was fair game.

Perhaps $1 million is enough. Perhaps it isn't. It needs to be re examined as the population in the area has increased.

[Greg]

MD asked the interesting question about the "folly" of building a home here on the rift of an active volcano.

My family and friends on the mainland have asked the same question from their location on the San Andreas fault. [8D]

The folly of building here is to construct a large home on a slab that is pretty much Lava Bait. Hawaiians have lived here happily for centuries by making homes and villages that are modest, modular, and can be moved if lava approaches.

The Rift and its inherent discouragement of development is actually a large plus as far as I'm concerned.

[Dave Smith]

quote:

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Originally posted by Obie

quote:

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Originally posted by Dave Smith

The article's failure to mention the major blowout in the early 1990s presents a rather skewed view of opposition to the plant. That episode helped teach PGV that standard geothermal practices wouldn't work with the particularly corrosive resource here in Hawaii and that community safety was not something to trifle with.

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Wow I remember that !! Most of the first responders died and even today, that area where the plant is located is a vast wasteland !!!

Oh wait!!

There was no destruction or deaths.

We could have the cheapest power in the Hawaiian Islands !!
Why wouldn't we want that ??

Have you driven past a wind farm or large PV farm that didn't look like an eyesore ??

When I drive past PGV I see nothing but a large derrick.They could stick artificial palm fronds on it and I would be good.

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Apparently you weren't here when it happened, or perhaps you're a fan of toxic levels of hydrogen sulfide. The entire area around the plant was evacuated for about 22 hours, if I recall correctly, as a well vented the gas without any control. During the episode the pressure began forcing the wellhead out of the ground; after it was pushed nearly a foot out PGV placed an I-beam on it and parked two D-9 bulldozers on that to keep it from being pushed out completely. If that had happened the well would have continued to vent uncontrollably until a diversion well could be drilled a la the BP disaster.

Is that your idea of an eyesore?

I said nothing about geothermal's potential, just noted that if we forget the past mistakes we are in danger of repeating them. I happen to think that done correctly, geothermal is worthwhile and vastly superior to turning fossil fuels into CO2 in our atmosphere. So is nuclear, for that matter.

But geothermal is also not the panacea that you describe. Over time the resource has gone from 75 percent steam to 75 percent brine, which has far less potential for electrical generation. And with wells blocked by a variety of things, including dropped tools and a magma pocket, PGV has struggled to meet even its existing obligations to HELCO, let alone expand to meet all our power needs. Because it has been developing other power sources, HELCO has also been reluctant to expand its contract with PGV. Hopefully breaking the "avoided cost" pattern, where power generation is tied to oil costs, will open up more possibilities for PGV – if it's up to it.

[james weatherford]

"...geothermal is also not the panacea that you describe."


Like the failure of geothermal to reduce electricity rates in Hawaii (as Rob said, due to PUC) despite continuous talk about it doing just that, geothermal in Hawaii has also continued to have technical limitations demonstrating the fundamental reality of no free lunch.

There really may be too much hard-sell and over-promise coming out of the Geothermal Working Group.

James Weatherford, Ph.D.
15-1888 Hialoa
Hawaiian Paradise Park

[Obie]

This blowout occurred in 1991.

It released about 2000 lbs of hydrogen sulfide and no one was seriously harmed.In the last 19 years there have been basically zero emissions.

Here is the amount of gasses released in the state in one year by fossil fuel electric plants in Hawaii.

Carbon Dioxide 9,045,661 metric tons

Sulfur Dioxide 21,284 metric tons
Nitrogen Oxide 21,618 metric tons


The price of electric on the Big Island next month will be 33 cents per kilowatt hour.PGV is going to uncouple their price from oil in future contracts.That should help lower the price.

[mdd7000]

I remember reading that all of the top ten polluters on the islands pollute something like 10% of what the volcano does, but no one threatens the volcano with EPA restrictions.