Mauna Loa erupting

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

It's really too bad that a barrier couldn't be built to prevent this flow

Or maybe site the road just slightly along Mauna Kea, a little above the saddle, so it would stay above any lava flow?  Since Mauna Kea most likely won’t erupt?

[TomK]

It's really too bad that a barrier couldn't be built to prevent this flow from oozing across a major highway.

Do I detect a hint of sarcasm there?

I do like Ken Hon's comment about exactly this point:

"Lava diversion is a tricky thing to do, especially on flat ground,” he said. “It really comes down to a volume problem. What we’re seeing now is — take 10 of the biggest dump trucks you can think of, we’re getting that many dump trucks of lava every second delivered by this lava flow. So if you think you can pile up stuff in front of it faster than it can delivery [sic] stuff, you’re probably wrong."

https://www.staradvertiser.com/2022/11/3...pectators/

[Or1on]

Sure seems like they don't want viewers but that is the exact reason there will be a big push of tourism to our island.  Tourists and locals will want to see.  $1,000 tickets and car towing is the latest threat.  

If one were trying to divert the lava wouldn't a D9 pushing old hardened lava around be the obvious choice?  Pile up enough rock and make it go somewhere else.  Seems worth trying but no way will the state or county try it.  Dude in Pahoa town tried it behind his house and the flow just stopped coincidentally.

If it does cross the saddle road will it be on the Kona side or Hilo side of the Mauna Kea access road?  Tom:  it would be a far drive going all the way around to work.  Got a Waimea or Waikaloa second home to stay at?

Then there's the issue with the big trucks and the weight limit of the unfinished bridges on the Hamakua side.  The construction slackers are now pushed to finish it quicker.  I was told even some fire engines have to go over the saddle because they weigh too much for the other route.

[kalianna]

The "construction slackers" are just honest people trying to make a living. Let's not blame them for decisions made or not made in the county building.

[MyManao]

Ken Hon's comment about exactly this point..

Was focused on the point of contact, as if describing a wall, which in all instances of high volume effusion, as he pointed out, is futile. What Ken didn't discuss, and the USGS in general wants nothing to do with, is that the way to approach diversion is in nudging the flow, giving it an alternative path.

Ken, the USGS, will not go there, but Jack Lockwood, a now retired volcanologist who worked for a good portion of his life at HVO, is a strong proponent of lava diversion. During his time as a government employee he was bared from speaking out on the matter. But Jack's experience, his world view, is world wide, not limited to the official US Government's stance on the matter. And he's participated in several efforts elsewhere.

But here, in Hawaii, Jack did design and oversee the creation of the berms mauka of the Mauna Loa Solar Observatory. Look at a satellite view, Google maps etc, of the place.

IMO, in order to adequately deal with the current situation the diversion would have had to have been on the greater slope more mauka than where it has reached now. And, like Jack's berms above the solar observatory, the intent would not be to stop, but to nudge one side or another. But then, if anyone did that they would subsequently inherit some liability for everything the flow did thereafter, wouldn't they?

To deal with the flow as it is, on flat ground, trying to stop the flows advance entirely, I could imagine building a large berm facing the flow, but with intent using material, the rock on the back side, the Mauna Kea side, so as to build, dig, a really large trough, so if/when the flow does overtop the berm it is then encouraged to follow the trough laterally..

And still, nobody here, in the USA, will touch it. Note the cultural sensitivities in Ken's statement.

[TomK]

I was told even some fire engines have to go over the saddle because they weigh too much for the other route.

Why would fire engines have to go over Saddle Road when there are fire engines all over the island, including Pohakuloa?

[My 2 cents]

It's really too bad that a barrier couldn't be built to prevent this flow from oozing across a major highway.

That barrier would have to be big, long, tall. The topography along that stretch of the saddle is pretty flat, and the lava itself viscous enough that it isn't just running around. Instead, as it encounters barriers it's going to pile up and climb over them too.

I'm imagining a large perched pond, a 'secondary' lava lake, forming before the flows get over to the Mauna Kea side. In that case where the lava goes from there can be in any direction. Whichever side of the levies that form is breached first.
_______________________________________________________________

Seems like encouraging the breach to happen at a location that would cause the least amount of damage would be the better way.

That will never happen.  So it will start a new guessing game of where will the breach happen naturally?  Most likely (my guess) is that it will happen towards the opposite end of the flat area from the flow front.  Which side is anybody's guess, with drastically different results.

[Or1on]

"The "construction slackers" are just honest people trying to make a living. Let's not blame them for decisions made or not made in the county building."


Hah okay.  That being true, is this part not true?  You see it all the time.  https://imgflip.com/memetemplate/2232854...-observing

"Why would fire engines have to go over Saddle Road when there are fire engines all over the island, including Pohakuloa?"

That is a good question but fact of the matter is they do drive back and forth over the saddle.  Quote from the spouse of a fireman.

[kalakoa]

there will be a big push of tourism to our island

Per the Mayor, tourists are perfectly safe so long as they stay in a legal resort.

[Durian Fiend]

I'll guess 24 hrs. after it crosses the Saddle Rd.

It will be longer than that to cross the road.  And then, how long to wait for the lava to cool until the dozers can get to work?

I was up there this AM from 430-5.  Minimal traffic on the way up from Hilo. Looked like a lot more cars coming from Kona side.