MK controversy thread

[TomK]

And some more:

"Here’s why the Office of Hawaiian Affairs wants to repeal the new Maunakea management group"

"A majority of the members, about seven, are Native Hawaiian. The authority was seen as an effort to give Native Hawaiians more of a say in the management of Maunakea."

[...]

"Kealoha Pisciotta, a long-time advocate for improved mauna management, said the lawsuit is not against the Native Hawaiians appointed to the committee.

""It’s not about that. It’s about the process, and the ceded lands and OHA’s role because OHA was supposed to be on the authority and then they got booted. And OHA … it’s not like 'Oh we’re offended.' It’s like, 'We’re mandated,'" Pisciotta said."

[TomK]

I'm summarizing this as briefly as I can. There are many articles out there you can find if you need more info.

The US National Science Board (NSB), the managing board for the National Science Foundation (NSF), has decided to provide funding of $1.6 billion to the US Extremely Large Telescope Program. This includes the TMT and the Giant Magellan Telescope (GMT) in Chile. Both projects now have expected costs of around $3 billion. Although both have funding from other sources, the amount of money being provided by the NSB will likely mean only one telescope will be funded by them and the NSF needs to choose which one. Given Europe is way ahead in building its own extremely large telescope in Chile, if the NSF chooses the GMT it'll be well behind Europe and there will be no 30-meter class telescope in the northern hemisphere. If the TMT is chosen instead, then it runs into the controversies I'm sure everyone here is aware of.

https://www.nsf.gov/nsb/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=309171&org=NSB&from=news
https://www.science.org/content/article/...telescopes
https://ww2.aip.org/fyi/nsf-likely-to-dr...tion-funds

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

I take the miles of new highway regulations near the access roads as a good

sign.

[HiloJulie]

While I understand that if TMT was chosen to receive this funding, not all of it would come directly to Hawaii, but one hell of a good chunk of it would!

The economy would sure love it!

But, as TomK says "it runs into the controversies I'm sure everyone here is aware of."

[MyManao]

it runs into the controversies I'm sure everyone here is aware of.

That's only if they continue to believe in their colonial bs. If, as I have pointed out from the get go, they were to address the Hawaiians directly the possibilities are wide open. But yeah, continue to deal with the white men that took over the place and they'll never get what they want.

Ain't that a shame? I'd love to see the TMT get built here, and look forward to the science it will do. But the Hawaiians have chosen to make their stand over it. And as such to get what the TMT wants they need to address what the Hawaiians want. Simple right? But no, keep acting like a colonial power and they'll lose.. we'll all lose.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

The Hawaiians want a Hawaiian Kingdom, or a Kingdom of Hawaii, Christianity, and/or traditional religious practices, a county job, or maybe move to Vegas.  Please describe what you refer to as a single entity, The Hawaiians, all agree on that they would like.

[TomK]

I think it's safe to say that some people object to the TMT on Mauna Kea and they are from various backgrounds. What a shame race being brought into the thread.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

My Manao -
All I said is Native Hawaiian people are a diverse group.  Do you disagree?

There are several words that describe calling the actions of a specific group as all the same:
Stereotyping
Racial profiling 

Generally people who do this want a simple way to look at human beings.  It’s easier to think everyone in a group acts the same way.  Rather than recognize the diversity within the group, which requires attention to detail, and seeing each person as an individual.

[terracore]

The Hawaiians want a Hawaiian Kingdom, or a Kingdom of Hawaii, Christianity, and/or traditional religious practices, a county job, or maybe move to Vegas.  Please describe what you refer to as a single entity, The Hawaiians, all agree on that they would like.

More Native Hawaiians live on the mainland than in Hawaii.  I wonder what the "majority" that don't live here think about TMT?  Clearly the non-natives who DO live here don't have a valid voice or vote.

Funny how that works.

[HiloJulie]

"And as such to get what the TMT wants they need to address what the Hawaiians want. Simple right?"

At what point in time has ANY individual or group "protester" of TMT stated that there is a "negotiable" way to construct TMT and if so, what would take?