Hawaii Decarbonization Settlement 2045

[kalianna]

randomq: "they might want shelter from the rain or a toilet to pray to"
Agreed. I was just pointing out that I donʻt think that alternative energy would do much to solve our homeless problem. But weʻll save that for a different thread.

[HiloJulie]

Be it climate change or homelessness, along with a whole plethora of other issues, EVERY SINGLE LIVING HUMAN has to “start with the man (and woman) in the mirror.”

Myself included. And if you don’t think so, you’re the only problem humanity has. 

(This video contains images that may trigger emotional strife, viewer discretion is advised)

[punikahakaiferret]

Sadly, some of the homeless/unhomed have lost their humanity; they can no longer see "the man in the mirror"...he died long ago, along with their hope.

This is in no way excusing, accepting or articulating for...just that it is a simple fact. How to reach and save those who for many don't even know they need saving?

I have no answers. I wish I did.

Hungry ghosts abound
Batu, bureaucrats do too
Neither are a cure

[HiloJulie]

Sadly, I agree to an extent.

I'd say the first "paradigm" change that has to take place is the realization that any addiction is a social health care issue and not a criminal justice issue.

Understanding why they are willing to give up every damn good thing about life, including life itself, for a drug - I think understanding the reasons why goes a long way in solving the entire issue.

But as for climate change, never stop looking in the mirror!

[TomK]

The discussion about homeless people seems to be a bit of a distraction. If nothing is done about climate change, then future children and grandchildren are looking at a future where they may become homeless because the current and previous generations didn't deal with the problem.

[Punatang]

There is a Nexus.  Just food for thought that hopefully no one takes personal offense to.  Sometimes it does not hurt to look at things from an odd perspective.

Homeless people generally contribute less to climate change via lower consumption, reduced energy use, less transportation emissions, minimal waste generation, and a much smaller physical footprint.  They generally do not fly to the mainland.  For the most part they don't pimp The Aina to tourists.  They are however, arguably the most exposed to climate variations.

They exemplify  the ethos of reduce, reuse, recycle.  Just look.

Maybe, watching the way we, the housed consumers live, has something to do with the way they live.

When did we allow our label to become "consumers"?

Maybe it is the housed consumers who need saving?  This thread is about us needing saving, right?  Do we know we need saving?

Streetwise survivors
Teach us to adapt and thrive
Nature's harsh lessons

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

look at things from an odd perspective

Much of what you say is true, they live a simple life.
But where do many of them find food, clothing, and sometimes shelter? From those leading a higher carbon life.

In addition to the question “can we learn a thing or two from the unhoused” I would also ask “is the unhoused lifestyle sustainable?”

[randomq]

I think sustainable living leads to less homelessness. Stressors like finances often push people over the edge. In a society where housing is affordable and utility bills are low, there is a lot less stress. Go a step further and have congregate housing (which is even more affordable and green) for folks that can't handle managing a household on their own.

[HiloJulie]

I'd first like to say that the intention I had in posting the "Man in the Mirror" video/song was not to highlight homelessness, although the video does capture a lot of that, it was to amplify the meaning of the song itself.

But to answer the question of what is sustainable, I think, after we look in the mirror, we have to realize that the primary unsustainable elephant in the room is 8 billion people worldwide.

Beginning in 1960, the world population has increased by 1 billion people every 12 to 14 years. How, can a continued growth rate like that be sustainable, in any metric of measurement, be it food, housing, medical care, jobs, infrastructure plus everything else, and most importantly, its impact on the climate?

It's just simply impossible to continue human growth at that rate and keep Mother Earth a sustainable habitat.

[ironyak]

Dropping the haiku silliness for now (sorry ferret, it's been fun, but hard to do nuance in seventeen syllables :)

HiloJulie - the primary unsustainable elephant in the room is 8 billion people worldwide.

Total impact is the of number of people times the consumption of those people. Given that each person on average in the US emits 4x the amount of CO2 as the world average, it's a bit rich to be claiming that the other ~7.5 billion people living lower-polluting lifestyles are the real problem. When one country has only ~5% of the world population, but consumes 25% of the resources, it's not just the "man in the mirror", but 7 Brazilians or 18 Nicaraguans or 148 Madagascans that may want to have a talk with you about your excessive consumption for a single lifestyle.

What is your proposal for solving the current population/consumption dilemma?

HOTPE - In addition to the question “can we learn a thing or two from the unhoused” I would also ask “is the unhoused lifestyle sustainable?”

The unhoused are living low consumption lifestyles by necessity, existing on the fringes of a highly wasteful society. Both are unsustainable as they are built on unsustainable fossil fuels.

Perhaps to ground the discussion in something useful and pragmatic, do you have any tips or tricks for maintaining yields in the garden without the use of synthetic fertilizers (which of course are derived from fossil fuels)? As about half of all human mass is made from fossil-fuel-derived synthetic fertilizer, figuring out how to create sustainable yields without their use would be helpful going forward! Thanks!