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+--- Thread: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo (/showthread.php?tid=17312)
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RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 03-05-2017
having found new strength drew a line at their burial grounds.
There are no burial grounds at the site of the TMT. It is a fabrication by people against the TMT. The Environmental Impact Study discovered no graves, nor did cultural and historical studies.
If you have any information that graves exist on the 5 acre site of the TMT please share it along with your source. Otherwise...
Saying that there are graves is not an alternate viewpoint. It's a fabrication. That's the polite word.
You could never convince a monkey to give you a banana by promising him limitless bananas after death in monkey heaven.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - TomK - 03-05-2017
ohiagrrl wrote:
"That new section of Hwy 200 is structurally designed for moving big things up and down that big mountain; a visual clue. (Even if TMT isn't being built up there a bargaining chip for building new was taking down at least one old telescope.) The state and military support TMT, the economy needs anything, Standing Rock; political/legal trend clues. Prove me wrong, please."
Sorry, but I rarely respond positively to such an argument from ignorance. The TMT has nothing to do with the Saddle Road improvements (as was shown earlier in this thread) and although I know the state support the TMT, or say they do, I am not aware of the military saying they support it. Nor does it matter, as the TMT is not a military facility. If you are going to make claims, it is up to you to support them, not for others to disprove.
https://youtu.be/n8qe70ifJ9Y
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - ohiagrrl - 03-05-2017
HotPE, you wrote:
"If someone says a family member was buried on Mauna Kea, I don't doubt that's true, it's nearly one third of the Big Island...."
Has anyone in the Hawaiian community identified which Moku that site falls within and which family was the last steward of the land? It's above Waimea but below the ridge, right? How deep did they dig? The whole 5 acres or is 5% of the area considered acceptable by archeologists? Were archeologists even involved? Who was it? The University? If it was anyone affiliated with TMT it would be a murky affair. What are the statistics of bones found during an EIS v. those found during an actual dig itself? I only ever hear of bones unearthed when large haulers are involved. Where is the EIS published? Was there any oversight by the disputing parties? I'm not even a died in the wool opponent yet I find it completely unbelievable that no bones were found whatsoever in the construction of the 12 existing structures up topside and in light of accusations that staff repeatedly moved and then eliminated a pohaku....and you wonder why people are dubious? Some early sensitivity training could have gone a long way toward avoiding this conflict entirely.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - ohiagrrl - 03-05-2017
TomK,
Thanks for being informative as ever. No military. I guess TMT will never be doing contract work for NASA or Mars missions, huh? Too bad, that would have been a nice commission. How's Zurich? Hi to Galileo.
In this NY Times article David Ige says that if TMT goes up, three telescopes would have to come down.
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/04/science/hawaii-thirty-meter-telescope-mauna-kea.html?_r=0
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 03-05-2017
I'm not even a died in the wool opponent
All of the questions you asked can quickly be answered with a Google search. Almost all documents are available online. The EIS is a 300-400 page pdf. All of the studies conducted were thorough and extensive.
You could never convince a monkey to give you a banana by promising him limitless bananas after death in monkey heaven.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - TomK - 03-05-2017
"Too bad, that would have been a nice commission."
What on earth are you on about?
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - galileo - 03-05-2017
Are most people on the Big Island aware that Lanny Sinkin received money from the Russian government?
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - TomK - 03-05-2017
Galileo - I really don't think that's a route we should be going down as it'll just go off-topic very quickly.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - kalakoa - 03-06-2017
The general populous of Hawaiian culture is expected to continuously conform to Western standards and watch resources handed over without complaint.
It's called "statehood". Had the Native Hawaiians maintained their resistance the way that the Native Americans did before them, the Hawaiians might have recognition and territory by now. They chose to wait for TMT instead.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 03-06-2017
Hawaiian culture is expected to... watch resources handed over without complaint.
...
It's called "statehood". Had the Native Hawaiians maintained their resistance...
Thanks for clearing that up. Watching the hearings, I thought she was referring to social security, medicare, and medicaid.