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+--- Thread: Hawaii history and cannibalism (/showthread.php?tid=16572)
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - PunaMauka2 - 11-01-2015
"They thought they were eating dog intestines."
I hate it when that happens.
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - pahoated - 11-01-2015
Bzzzt! Wrong! Cannibalism is humans eating other humans for food.
The Hawaiians ate parts of flesh and organs, much as some white hunters eat the heart of fresh kills. Again, with all the Euro-centric views of everything. Never mind that Europe at this time found no problems with leaving the heads of beheaded people in public squares for public entertainment and education.
This is a big issue for Victorian Tom because it is just a fact of history. After Captain Crook was killed, the rest of the crew was overwhelmed and had to retreat without his body. They fired cannon at the shore but the Hawaiians just pulled back out of range. The message was forwarded to the Crown that Captain Crook had been killed and his body not recovered. The Crown through intermediaries sent a demand that Captain Crook's body be returned. "Proper" Europe at the time was horrified when some bones were sent back, all boiled and clean. This was a huge moment in history because the British were so horrified, they didn't send another expedition to Hawaii for over 10 years. In that time, American whalers, having depleted all the whales on the East coast, were wiping out the whales in the Pacific. They found out about a beautiful island rest stop in the middle of the Pacific, and the rest, as they say, is history and why Amerika became the next conqueror of the Hawaiian islands, not the British.
Also, while some heiau were for human sacrifice (Euro-centric people call their own "prisons" and "execution chambers"), there were also healing heiau, astronomy heiau, spiritual heiau. There were also multiple types of halau. People need to remember all these were torn apart and scattered by kanaka maoli, those that had rejected the kapu and became converted to christians. And so the high priestess of Pele curse on the kanaka maoli Hawaiian people was fulfilled, kanaka maoli against kanaka maoli till there are no more kanaka maoli any more.
"Aloha also means goodbye. Aloha!"
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 11-01-2015
pahoated:
The message was forwarded to the Crown that Captain Crook had been killed and his body not recovered. The Crown through intermediaries sent a demand that Captain Crook's body be returned.
The Captain Cook Society:
Where is Captain Cook buried?
Captain Cook was killed at Hawaii on 14 February 1779. A week later his remains were formally buried at sea in Kealakekua Bay, Hawaii.
http://www.captaincooksociety.com/home/captain-cook-society/faq
I have a question.
How in 1779 do you get a message from Hawaii to England and back again in under a week?
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - PunaMauka2 - 11-01-2015
Nevermind the logistics of 18th century long distance communication. If a Protector shows an intention to ceremoniously strip the flesh from the bones of you or a loved one, consider it a sign of utmost respect.
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - Bullwinkle - 11-01-2015
Most if not all cannibalism is ritualistic. Reading accounts of folks forced to survive by eating their dead or almost dead companions - a diet of human flesh causes tremendous (if not fatal) health problems
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alive:_The_Story_of_the_Andes_Survivors
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - Chunkster - 11-01-2015
quote:
Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge
How in 1779 do you get a message from Hawaii to England and back again in under a week?
Coconut wireless?
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - MarkP - 11-01-2015
I imagine that health problems that result from starving people eating their companions are mostly due to the fact that by the time it gets that bad nobody has much nutrition left in their body. I have heard of something similar when early explorers survived on rabbits, hares, and other small animals during a famine. Everybody and everything was starving and was extremely lean. Today we have all sorts of problems due to excessive fat in our diets but a diet of pure protein with insufficient fat eventually degrades your nervous system.
In general I imagine that any culture in which one group of people had a sustainable supply of other healthy people to eat was a rare one.
Nevertheless there seems to be plenty that is objectionable about early Hawaiian history just as there is about early European history. My only gripe is the whitewashing that Hawaiian history gets at the hands of the pro-sovereignty crowd.
ETA: replaced their with there
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - Lodestone - 11-01-2015
Shouldn't this thread be combined with the Where do you go for great food in Hilo thread?
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - PunaMauka2 - 11-01-2015
Stay away from the Donner Party Cafe.
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Damn, MarkP pretty much nailed it.
RE: Hawaii history and cannibalism - dmbwest - 11-01-2015
+1 Lodestone .. damm funny.
aloha,
pog