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+--- Thread: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo (/showthread.php?tid=17312)
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RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - kalakoa - 09-18-2016
Did the self-appointed protectors follow those procedures or not?
...so we come full circle to "did they follow the procedures".
comfortable in the knowledge that they won't be challenged because they are "special".
...which sounds similar to "won't be challenged because they're spending $1.4B".
Maybe it's time for both sides to admit they're playing the same game?
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - randomq - 09-18-2016
All the deities, mana, and ancestors in the world have not prevented one war, or saved one suffering child from leukemia. They apparently have no problem with the underhanded overthrow of the Hawaiian Kingdom, or the desecration of Mauna Kea either, as they have done nothing. Logically, what does this mean?
A. Gods, mana, and ancestors spirits don't exist.
B. They exist but don't care about our earthly matters.
C. They exist, but the invading gods and ancestors defeated them.
Man can't know for sure which of those is true, but a thinking man can surely doubt anyone who claims to understand or speak for the dead.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - MarkP - 09-18-2016
Are you talking to me Ted? Because you chose not to address my point. What "highly regarded enemy"? What grave? What funeral? I was referring to the guys who got left to rot because they were nobody. Going into great detail about burial practices makes my point in a way.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - pahoated - 09-18-2016
It is funny how these coincidences keep happening.
There is a new burial site in the middle of the TMT site. Native Hawaiians have been allowed by law to bury their dead on native grounds, even their home land property.
Mauna Kea is recognized as an active Native Hawaiian burial ground area, as well as an ancestral burial area.
The new Native Hawaiian burial site in the middle of the TMT site was applied for, as required by law, and was granted legally.
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/TMT-Doc-252-Fergerstrom.pdf
Looks like another issue has materialized.
*Japanese tourist on bus through Pahoa, "Is this still America?*
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - Aaron S - 09-18-2016
quote:
Originally posted by pahoated
It is funny how these coincidences keep happening.
There is a new burial site in the middle of the TMT site. Native Hawaiians have been allowed by law to bury their dead on native grounds, even their home land property.
Mauna Kea is recognized as an active Native Hawaiian burial ground area, as well as an ancestral burial area.
The new Native Hawaiian burial site in the middle of the TMT site was applied for, as required by law, and was granted legally.
https://dlnr.hawaii.gov/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/TMT-Doc-252-Fergerstrom.pdf
Looks like another issue has materialized.
Yes, SHPD was notified of the alleged burial site, but they haven't done anything further regarding the notification of this burial. In other words, they haven't approved anything. Please show me in said document where SHPD has taken any action.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - MarkP - 09-18-2016
I'm not sure how to react to this. It is hard to believe that reasonable application of whatever laws apply were not anticipated leaving me to strongly suspect that this is yet another bogus manipulation that will ultimately not be upheld but that may still do the damage it was intended to do if it clogs things up until the TMT goes elsewhere. Can any Native Hawaiian choose to have grandpa interred on the lawn of Iolani Palace? Is this a re-burial? If so, and even if not, why was this use not anticipated by the protesters before now?
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - pahoated - 09-18-2016
This is the law in Hawaii and there was a recent ruling allowing Native Hawaiians to have burial plots on their land. It seems an ancient native burial ground area is the same as a cemetery.
"Where can bodies be buried in Hawaii?
In Hawaii, bodies must be buried on land approved as a cemetery by the county council. Before burying a body on private land or establishing a family cemetery, you should check with the local registrar."
This really puts a knot in the knickers. The next step is getting a ruling that the top of Mauna Kea is recognized as a burial ground, in the past and the present. They guy did fill out the application and it looks like it was approved. There is probably mad scrambling going on, just before the judge's hearing field trip.
*Japanese tourist on bus through Pahoa, "Is this still America?*
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - HereOnThePrimalEdge - 09-18-2016
They guy did fill out the application and it looks like it was approved.
Where does it say approved? It's stamped "Received."
Anybody can file anything and get it stamped "Received" by a state agency.
“We’ve got to be as clear-headed about human beings as possible, because we are still each other’s only hope,” James Baldwin to Margaret Mead in the book A Rap On Race
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - TomK - 09-18-2016
HOTPE,
It's all quite confusing at the moment. The document in the Civil Beat article which says "Is denied in its entirety" doesn't seem to be related to the link pahaoted mentioned, although I might be mistaken (the dates are very different, as are the names). In either case, I don't see any approval by the DLNR or whoever makes these decisions.
RE: TMT - Contested Case Hearing Status - Hilo - Guest - 09-18-2016
This well-written article from last year tried to describe some of the allowed or disallowed Hawaiian traditions and practices atop the summit of Mauna Kea.
http://hawaiiindependent.net/story/hawaiian-rights-scrutinized-not-considered-during-tmt-contested-case
P.S. Mahalo PTed for sharing your version of some Hawaiian culture and the different burial procedures from the past.
Did Hawaiians really boil their battle killed and in some cases even eat the meat from their boiled bones in order to take the Mana from those highest regarded enemies?