Posts: 8,464
Threads: 1,032
Joined: May 2003
I am interested in this topic staying on subject and and not drifting off in parallel topics or member back biting.
I think the community is already upset. Casual speculation serves little purpose.
Assume the best and ask questions.
Punaweb moderator
Assume the best and ask questions.
Punaweb moderator
Posts: 58
Threads: 1
Joined: Jan 2014
thought the family jus said all da speculation and local advice was helpful? *scratches his head*
born in kona, raised in puna. lava flow area always get violence, mostly beat downs. all land down on the old flow was county beach park , then a biggggggg neighborhood owned by hundreds of haole and some local families, small kine parcels, nuthin big. the lava tours don't own the land, they jus cross it illegally like all other peeps. the coast trail belong to public
Posts: 1,406
Threads: 25
Joined: Jun 2013
Lots of misinformation about ownership. The new land created by the flow(mostly makai of Uncle's) is owned by the state.
Kalapana Gardens was covered with lava and remains private(although at a slightly higher elevation). KG is where you see scattered dwellings occupied by mostly newcomers.
The land from KG to the viewing area and towards the National Park is covered and privately owned.(To the Park boundary). The county had to negotiate with the owners for passage rights.(liability, etc)The old highway is state owned, but cannot be found without a survey or GPS.
The Coastal trail is perfectly legal for access, but seldom used. Some tour groups have permission to take the more direct (private) route to the ocean entry, and many do not.
Posts: 58
Threads: 1
Joined: Jan 2014
quote:
Originally posted by snorkle
The land from KG to the viewing area and towards the National Park is covered and privately owned.(To the Park boundary). The county had to negotiate with the owners for passage rights.(liability, etc)
so who all owns that part of it?
Posts: 1,406
Threads: 25
Joined: Jun 2013
That specific information would be on a County tax key map. You're going to have to do your own research. My information comes from the County officials that negotiated the agreement in 2008.
If you don't believe me, it's OK, the ownership stays the same.
Posts: 58
Threads: 1
Joined: Jan 2014
No probz I did my hikes from the county viewing area. i jus cross over da old royal gardens subdivision to go see old ocean entry when it was still going. lot of people go that way, right from the parkin lot
Posts: 7
Threads: 0
Joined: Jan 2014
Land reclamation is a delicate topic with native Hawaiians. While OHA and other agencies pretend to serve the people of Hawaii only 6000 properties have actually been given to native people since those organizations were formed. It spans some 60+ years(don't quote me) to include all of the islands. Kalapana was a sacred place to Hawaiians. It is believed by many that its taking by Pele had to do with all of the haoles who came and bought large tracks of farm land and subdivided it producing Kalapana Gardens. It is an insult to the people of Hawaii to have the state come in, reclaim land and resell it to another group of haoles while the original people of this island go without. There are a large number of people who believe that IS THEIR LAND. I believe this is where all the confusion is coming from. I really think a lot of people here need to educate themselves on a few things. I would guess 95% of you are haoles. Those poor kids walked into a firestorm. Sorry to anyone I may have offended with my first post.
Posts: 58
Threads: 1
Joined: Jan 2014
yup yup true about the OHA. everyone disappointed!
Jus cause some realtor tell the boy and his gf that it's land for sale, but then u come down here and it isnt so clear! i bet they didnt know what they were getting into! and the lava tours are big big time business also! shoots u cant just go in buy big pieces of land do it like that! even tho it's legal on paper the kalapana boyz say different! still no reason for killing the boy and his gf, tho I agree that our ohanas deserve more land!
Posts: 10
Threads: 1
Joined: Jan 2014
(1) There is knowledge that helps us, improves the quality of our lives, gives us a sense of security and freedom, happiness and satisfaction. Then:
(2) There is knowledge that disables us, places us into bondage, imprisons us with uncertainty, gives us grief and desperation.
If you possess knowledge of a murder or murder(s) your first reaction might be of fear, leading to scenario 2 (above) which is a horrible way to live -maybe understandable- because of your fear, but it doesn't get better, ever. Not only do you live with fear but also with guilt and regret for being too fearful to expose the truth and do what is right.
Living with knowledge that makes you live in fear; imprisons you, fills you with regret and guilt leading to depression and desperation that will eventually destroy you and follow you to the end of your natural days.
However, you can turn scenario 2(above) into scenario 1 (above) by overcoming fear with the knowledge that standing up against that which would imprison you and degrade your life, will ultimately free you. Knowledge that you don't have to cower in fear. Knowledge that there is another road to take. Knowledge that can live in light, instead of darkness.
Knowledge is powerful and there are two paths, (1) leads to a better life (2) leads to destruction. We may not be able to control all of the knowledge that comes to us but we can certainly decide how it will control us.
Posts: 61
Threads: 0
Joined: Dec 2013
I was honored to see the testimony of Amrita. Their story, as well as their circumstances, were eerily similar to mine, and I hoped there would be others in the area that would come forth with similar testimony.
Like Amrita, the tour guide that threatened my group on the first occasion was makai (towards the water) side of our group also. The KCT guide had a particular trail that he took, or so I assumed, and my entry was usually mauka (towards the mountain) of his.
Also, in agreement with Amirita's statement, on one night that I was threatened, the KCT tour group took an extremely risky choice by taking their group across a fresh upper hanging shelf (not ocean shelf)that had been created very recently. Very, Very dangerous, as I've never seen an upper shelf hang for more than a couple of weeks at most before crashing to the shoreline near the ocean shelf.
If anyone doubts the testimony of people like Amrita or I, I welcome anyone to go read the Yelp reviews of Kalapana Cultural Tours that were provided earlier in this topic by Sarah Johnson. There are two (or more) reviews that directly correlate situations similar to what I and others have experienced. More people like Amrita and I will be coming forth, as I easily assume dozens (if not hundreds) have experienced the same violence.
As for land near the lava flow, the land that people were using to cross over to the lava flow was not owned by any single family, whether they are "haole" or "local". The land is owned privately, and divided into several shares. No single entity, or lava tour company for that matter, controls any of the land that people commonly use to access the former ocean entry flow. There is a "local" family that "claims" territory in the area, but this claim is not legally backed by the tax map keys in the Kaimu-Kalapana zone. There is no one to "regulate" the area in which people walk to the lava because the land is either inside of state/park control, or owned by numerous entities that have yet to return and rebuild their land.
The assumption that anyone, particularly a lava tour company, owns 900 acres of the old lava flow is beyond ridiculous. If such were true, that person would not only own a large proportion of county land, but also the land of dozens of other land-owners.
When it comes to a murder case, let's talk legalities. When it comes to legalities, Boaz Johnson and Brittany Royal were not trespassing more than anyone else when it comes to making trips to the llava flow at the ocean entry. Likewise, they not were purchasing property belonging to anyone else other than the actual owner or realtor.
Despite the cultural/racial/political differences, particularly when it comes to land management and native rights in the Kalapana area, actual land ownership is a completely different topic in a judicial court room.
I'll conclude by admitting I'm a bit disappointed at the censorship/warnings being given to various forum members that share information in context to faulty investigative work concerning Hawaii's past/present, as well as members that share speculative theories concerning the possible murder of Boaz Johnson. After reading the posts submitted in the past 2 weeks, it is my understanding that the Johnson family has a high amount of interest in this information being shared by members of the local community, and I hope this forum doesnt't turn into yet another roadblock in their desperate attempts to gather information from Puna residents.
~Aloha
|
