Hawaiians, Shorelines & “Mother Ocean’s” Revenge

[TomK]

Let me just add to the "lies about the TMT" list HOTPE provided:

"* The TMT has lasers that will destroy small cities
* The TMT has military applications
* Telescopes on Mauna Kea make profits amounting to millions of dollars per year
* TMT approval was "rubber stamped." (Over a period of 7 years?)
* TMT is building on a burial site"

* The TMT will be obsolete by the time it's built;
* The TMT threatens the aquifer;
* Lake Waiau will be used as a source of water for the TMT;
* The TMT threatens the wekiu bug;
* TMT proponents are being paid by the TMT;
* The TMT will bring more than one million tourists per year to the summit;
* PGV will need to expand to provide power for the TMT;
* The TMT will spill mercury into the environment;
* The TMT will only provide high-paying jobs to mainlanders;
* The Saddle and summit access roads will have to be widened.

I'm sure there are plenty of others, but other than those HOTPE mentioned, these are the first that come to mind.

[TomK]

Let me add a complete contradiction as well from gypsy:

Just the other day - http://www.punaweb.org/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=23530&whichpage=6

"I would not like to see a calm and peaceful mountain like Mauna Kea become a target like pearl harbor once did, WW3 involvement perhaps. "

18 months ago - http://www.punaweb.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=21074&whichpage=55

"Maunakea was once known to be a place that was peaceful, quiet, and calm. Hope those kind of qualities can return someday for future generations as well."

[kalakoa]

most local males do not want to go to college, but instead aspire to be in law enforcement

$80K salary with pension and benefits, and a union to ensure annual raises.

How does that compare with an astronomer's salary?

[TomK]

Not a fair comparison. Young astronomers at the start of their career won't be paid anything like that. Senior astronomers will likely be paid more due to the increased responsibilities they hold. Astronomers also don't have a union in the same sense as the police (there's the IAU, but it's not a union that represents astronomers' employment).

But a typical astronomer will have to go through nearly a decade of poverty to get into the field. There's no guarantee they will be able to stay in the field either no matter how good a scientist they are. It's not the same for someone who chooses to become a cop.

[kalakoa]

a typical astronomer will have to go through nearly a decade of poverty

Maybe the lack of "Native Hawaiian" astronomers has nothing to do with the availability of university education or local telescopes.

[TomK]

PS. Let me add that I know no-one who became an astronomer for the money. The same qualifications you have after getting a PhD in astrophysics is extremely attractive to banks and other organizations who will pay you much more than any university or observatory. Those who stay in the field want to study and research astronomy and physics. Those who are only interested in money move elsewhere.

[TomK]

PPS. In any case, how does this matter? gypsy69 has already spoken for native Hawaiians.

They're not interested in money.

[kalakoa]

They're not interested in money.

Then "they" won't mind if we balance the budget by cutting their benefit checks.

[TomK]

Going back to the lies about the TMT, something I saw in a post today reminded me of a post I made back in February:

http://www.punaweb.org/Forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22438&whichpage=62

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1) "We also engaged in another simulation, where we went up to Pu`u Poliahu … and there, too, the red balloon was still in the sky. And from there you could see that it would be impossible to get a view of, say, the rising sun without the TMT in the viewplane."

2) "Ward then asked if, from Poliahu, the TMT would also obstruct views of Pu`u Makanaka. Makanaka is a cinder cone where a number of pre-contact Hawaiian sites and burials have been located.

“Yes,” Townsend replied."

3) "Throughout her testimony, at several points, Townsend stated the Thirty Meter Telescope would be “an 18-story, five-acre building,” describing it as “a structure bigger than anything on the island of Hawai`i.”"

4) "Yet when asked by Ward to discuss the widened jeep trail leading to the TMT site, Townsend said that the widening had destroyed wekiu bug habitat. “It’s been decimated,” she said. “That cinder has been compacted. And wekiu can’t live in compacted cinder. … They are endangered, and they are a beautiful symbol of the kind of unique and amazing natural environment in Hawai`i. ”"

5) "Cindy Freitas asked Townsend if she had knowledge of the glaciers on Mauna Kea. “I know that they exist, that’s about it,” Townsend replied."

All of these are claims by the Director of the Hawaii chapter of the Sierra Club, Marti Townsend. Not one of them is true. Yet she testified to them in the contested case hearing.

http://www.environment-hawaii.org/?p=9484

[punaticbychoice]

Pisciotta and Townsend have caused me to dispense with
Kahea / Green Party and The Sierra Club respectively.
Not to be taken seriously.