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PFFFFFFFF
Right off, this is a good indicator of where this "article" is coming from:
"...How many supporters really understand what it means to be survivors of genocide? How many supporters can understand the history of the survivors of the overthrow and the genocide where the language, dance and other cultural expressions of the indigenous people were forbidden by the new masters?..."
...please.
"Some get it, some never will.
JMO."
One of the most useless comments repeated here.
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gen·o·cide
#712;jen#601;#716;s#299;d/
noun
the deliberate killing of a large group of people, especially those of a particular ethnic group or nation.
synonyms: mass murder, mass homicide, massacre; annihilation, extermination, elimination, liquidation, eradication, decimation, butchery, bloodletting; pogrom, ethnic cleansing, holocaust
"a tyrant guilty of genocide"
When did Americans kill a large group of Hawaiians? When did Hawaiians kill a large group of Menehune? Some people exist in their own special little fantasy worlds.
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Beyond the usual inability to stay on subject, wonder if anybody knows what is going on now? It seems to have become very quiet but there are bits of news here and there. There was one news item that said they went ahead and arrested all the protesters blocking the road on Haleakala and are sending up the telescope parts at night. The latest on the protesters on Mauna Kea is about 7 are staying through the night in a shelter across the street from the visitors center. I think the ones arrested before had been identified as the ones that would sit across the road to block it. Probably, the crowd drives up during the day and leaves during the night. Haven't seen any news whether the tour buses are allowed back now. It must be the state is waiting for the final ruling on the permit challenge, then construction will start.
"Aloha also means goodbye. Aloha!"
*Japanese tourist on bus through Pahoa, "Is this still America?*
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How many Hawaiians did King Kamehameha kill in his wars to conquer the Islands?
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quote:
Originally posted by pahoated
It must be the state is waiting for the final ruling on the permit challenge, then construction will start.
There is no legal obstructions for the TMT to start construction now, so the balls in the TMT's court. However, I'm getting the impression that all the parties are waiting for the HawSCT to issue a ruling. They're in for a rude awakening, as it may several more months before that happens. Yes, the oral arguments are scheduled for August 27th, but I doubt there will be quick decision. The oral arguments for the DKIST (ATST) lawsuit happened several months ago and the HawSCT hasn't issued a ruling yet.
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quote:
Originally posted by opihikao
FYI: Excellent article. Represents a lot of the discussion here on PW, especially the majority, yet with an understanding of the total picture.
The problem with this commentary is this simple fact.
If the TMT and UH didn't go through seven year vetting process and didn't allow the community to comment on this project, yes his commentary would have a lot of validity. However, the reality is this pure and simple. The community was allowed to comment on the project during the EIS process. No one stepped forward to contest the FEIS in 2010.
The CDUP contested case hearing officer also upheld the granting of the TMT's conservation district use permit in 2013. Several anti-telescope groups participated in this hearing process.
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Most of the article focuses on "how the State has violated its own rules". As a resident of one of the many fine "illegally created" private subdivisions, this principle of "following the rules and laws" has lost much of its meaning. If the State is ever somehow held responsible for their actions, there will be a watershed of lawsuits covering every questionable land-use decision since Statehood if not earlier.
KAHEA figures that over 10 years, approximately $500 million in rental income that could have fuelled the economy and improved people’s lives has been lost.
Not building the telescope guarantees that over the next 10 years, approximately $350M in economic stimulus will simply not be applied to the local economy.
I would further suggest that money spent on lawsuits does very little for the public good.
I'm also fairly certain that our elected leadership doesn't care either way, because they can always just raise taxes (or short the pension fund) until the budget is balanced.
Perhaps the protestors can "win" by dragging everything out until it's simply too expensive to do business in Hawaii. Then, when business packs up and leaves, there will be no more "desecration".
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The governor noted that there is a court challenge to the project and he will abide by the decision of the court on this matter.
There is an interesting double-standard here:
If the court rules for TMT, protestors will insist that they are not subject to the ruling because the Western court system has no jurisdiction over them.
If the court rules against TMT, protestors will celebrate how their US Citizenship allows them to participate in the rule of law.
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Mililani Trask starts off her compendium of Facts with this statement:
Lease rental cannot be waived for any commercial venture for longer than one year.
Are the telescopes a commercial venture such as Walmart? Or Home Depo? I don't believe so, and if not, then all of her facts that follow are as false as her initial comment.
You'd think she'd know better, and she probably does.
"I'm at that stage in life where I stay out of discussions. Even if you say 1+1=5, you're right - have fun." - Keanu Reeves
