TMT construction begins Monday 15 July

[Rob Tucker]

I would prefer to see you folks discuss issues and not each other's motives.

Assume the best and ask questions.

Punaweb moderator

[snorkle]

glinda was kicked off PW for this statement; which certainly isn't as inflammatory as most of the vitriol spewed against Hawaiians here....somebody's gotta represent.


“Tom, from my perspective, a perspective I know you are loath to acknowledge, and feel, as you apparently do about so much, is beneath yours, you are a great spokesperson for those who have risen up against the telescope industry here. Seriously man, your lack of humility serves those you speak out against far more than the cause you speak for. And I know you'll never understand that. But keep in mind, and again from my perspective, if the TMT has to go, you contributed to its demise far more than you would wish.”-glinda

[Rob Tucker]

Wrong.

Assume the best and ask questions.

Punaweb moderator

[snorkle]

K; I'm done, peace!

[reni]

snorkle, some people are prejudiced, some are not. Some have other motives for playing people against each other.
No proof do we have on this forum of anyone's nationalities or skin colors, even Obie's .
Granted, Some comments are hard to take.....but that's just a side show and should not be allowed to steal the real show..

A suggestion for feeling better, click on to Tom's blog and view his incredible photography. ("Mother nature, you are beautiful, you are the song I sing" comes to my mind).

We have inept,crappy government and a segment of our society who feels deeply wronged . We also have an outside conglomerate wanting to invest in our County. What they could provide mankind is in my opinion incalculable at this stage.
the chance of correcting this impasse may be slipping away.

I doubt that it can be fixed by the players who helped create it.

I read all of these posts and it reminds me of randomly attempting to switch from "Hawaii's Story" by Queen Liliuokalani to "The Boston" by Lucien Young.
Schitzo ! How could 2 people (Liliuokalani & Young) from 2 separate cultures have such opposing views of the same event?!! History repeats itself right here on Punatalk.

[TomK]

I think this is a fair video on the position Maunakea Observatories find themselves in right now, although obviously missing a lot of specific details:

https://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/video/2019...e-workers/

Just to be clear as it's become very obvious in recent days that most people do not realize this: Maunakea Observatories is an organization consisting of all the current observatories on Mauna Kea. It does not include the TMT. Many seem to believe TMT is part of the organization and in fact leading it. This is completely false. You can see the observatories involved via the Maunakea Observatories website and for those on social media who see this false information, please feel free to correct those incorrect claims.

https://maunakeaobservatories.org/
https://maunakeaobservatories.org/about/

[TomK]

AKpilot,

"I meat to say "had" ........so wait? NO construction has occurred since the 15th (I've been in Germany dealing with a family emergency). How soon until they get started do you think?"

No construction has occurred and the TMT construction equipment didn't even make it to the summit access road let alone the summit area. As to when the situation changes, I have absolutely no idea.

[TomK]

I suggest people look up the history of Galileo and Copernicus. Despite their scientific discoveries, both were mistreated by the catholic church who condemned them and at least in the case of Copernicus, burned his books. Galileo was forced to abandon his research because it contradicted the church's teachings.

These are events that happened in the 16th and 17th century. We now have protestors telling astronomers that they cannot go to Mauna Kea to carry out their research.

It's happening again in the 21st century. How on earth did we get to this point again, hundreds of years later?

[randomq]

Political correctness, putting feelings ahead of the law and true equality and democracy. Allowing our government and corporations to fail us so much that people don't trust anything anymore, even when it is good.

[Obie]

Snorkle says
"
It's alarming that they would openly proclaim their superiority here. Like only Hawaiians (or other people of color here) have abandoned vehicles, drug problems, practice superstition, or are against the perceived American dream..... What a burden they must be to the white man here."

My point was that the people up on the mountain are claiming that the TMT will poison the aquifer and a million other things, while they ignore everything they themselves are doing.

When I referred to people on the mountain as they or them it's because there is a coalition of protesters that includes people from all over including some well known Haole protesters.
Would you call Jim Albertini a Hawaiian ?