Hawaii efforts to address the climate emergency

[ironyak]

TomK - It would be nice if the Hawaii bureaucracy would allow a road to be rebuilt to the Mauna Loa Observatory so that scientists can continue their work
Ironyak - Hopefully MLO can get back to their old digs pretty soon and continue their work there (which they are still doing in the meantime) and when (or if) we ever see snow at that elevation again...
Punatang - like your fear mongering speculation that we may never see snow on Mauna Kea again? ... If you want people to comprehend your fear-mongering speculation, you should work on writing more clearly.
MyManao - Nah, sorry P'tang, that failed.. maybe you like try again?

Misplacing blame and failing to connect is likely nothing new if the simple process of reading one word after the other as they proceed along, pausing when the punctuation indicates to do so, and then continuing onward afterwards creates such cognitive strain that by the time the end of the sentence is reached (even skipping over some parenthetical commentary and sesquipedalian terminology) all sense as to how it began, what the subject was, or even what year it is apparently, has been completely lost.

Punatang - Informed readers know that measurements were moved to Mauna Kea, "in the meantime".
While backup atmospheric measurements were started at Mauna Kea in late 2022, sampling was reestablished at MLO in March 2023 after they setup some extra solar power, with that aforementioned Hilo office being used to manage things. Be nice for everyone to get back up to Mauna Loa on a more permanent basis though via the convenience of their paved road.

Even though this was already pointed out in Tom's post, your swing and miss is somewhat understandable given your bush league status and Ralph Keeling inheriting his dad's wicked curve.

Fiend - I recall seeing snow on both of our summits this past winter. Also, Haleakala had some at a 3,000 ft. lower elevation. I wonder what the odds would be for a snowfall to appear on THAT summit for any given upcoming winter.
For clarity, MLO is on the flank of Mauna Loa at 11,134 ft (peak is at 13,679 ft) so pretty comparable to Haleakala at 10,023 ft. While it used to be a convenient spot to go play in the snow given the smooth pavement all the way to their gate (which also had a web camera for checking conditions), there have been fewer and fewer opportunities over the years, showing a bit of change in the overall, you know, something or other...

Whatever, I'm sure AI or API or someone will sort it all out, right? They do paint some purty pictures...

[TomK]

Punatang - Mahalo for all of the bias free research.
No problem, any time! I've found it's helpful to vet sources so as to avoid sounding like a dipshit rube, regurgitating unsubstantiated speculation based on motivated bias. Like the "fellow kids" say - don't wanna be an American (or useful) Idiot, right?

TomK - it's almost sure we will, despite longer-term climate change ... There's no way I'm brave enough to predict what will happen
So when, or if?

I would say "when". It's evident that the weather is a chaotic system, and you get extremes. Climate change, although not chaotic on its own, predicts more extremes in the weather.

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For clarity, MLO is on the flank of Mauna Loa at 11,134 ft (peak at 13,679 ft) so pretty comparable to Haleakala at 10,023 ft. While it used to be a convenient spot to go play in the snow given the smooth pavement all the way to their gate (which also had a web camera for checking conditions), there have been fewer and fewer opportunities over the years, showing a bit of change in the overall, you know, something or other...

Whatever, I'm sure AI or API or someone will sort it all out, right? They do paint some purty pictures...

It's not uncommon for snow to fall on Haleakala's summit.

https://shorturl.at/trE9X

[MyManao]

MyMan!  If I never read your garbled opinion pieces on Civil Beat, I might put stock in your writing advice..

Hey P'tang, please, don't take my advise about anything..

But brah, no need get yourself all tied up like that. I was just pointing out you didn't hit the mark. You were close, but knowing how much you can muster when encouraged I hoped razing you a bit would inspire rather than reap a dis. Oh well, let's hope for better days ahead. As to my published take on things.. yeah, I'm sorry to disappoint. But hey, if you can point to any of your prose as an example of how it's really done I'm eager to learn.

[TomK]

MyMan!  If I never read your garbled opinion pieces on Civil Beat, I might put stock in your writing advice..

Hey P'tang, please, don't take my advise about anything..

But brah, no need get yourself all tied up like that. I was just pointing out you didn't hit the mark. You were close, but knowing how much you can muster when encouraged I hoped razing you a bit would inspire rather than reap a dis. Oh well, let's hope for better days ahead. As to my published take on things.. yeah, I'm sorry to disappoint. But hey, if you can point to any of your prose as an example of how it's really done I'm eager to learn.

There's a very big difference between "razing" and "razzing". Bolding was mine.

[ironyak]

TomK - It's not uncommon for snow to fall on Haleakala's summit

Yeah, NWS says it averages once a season every couple years. The real question though is how's the drive from Puna compared to MLO - better, worse, or about the same (in the "you can't get there from here" sorta way ;)?

[TomK]

TomK - It's not uncommon for snow to fall on Haleakala's summit

Yeah, NWS says it averages once a season every couple years. The real question though is how's the drive from Puna compared to MLO - better, worse, or about the same (in the "you can't get there from here" sorta way)?

That question makes no sense. What are you asking to be compared? As to MLO, a lava flow is blocking the access road, making access difficult, no matter where you drive from.

[ironyak]

TomK - As to MLO, a lava flow is blocking the access road, making access difficult...
No, really? Seems like someone would have said something about that before. How about for Haleakala? (not sure if I should laugh or cry...)

Who? What? I Don't Know. Why? Because. Today, Tomorrow? I Don't Give A Damn (Naturally)

[TomK]

TomK - As to MLO, a lava flow is blocking the access road, making access difficult...
No, really? Seems like someone would have said something about that before. How about for Haleakala? (not sure if I should laugh or cry...)

Who? What? I Don't Know. Why? Because. Today, Tomorrow? I Don't Give A Damn (Naturally)

ironyak - you wrote:

"The real question though is how's the drive from Puna compared to MLO - better, worse, or about the same (in the "you can't get there from here" sorta way ?"

How can anyone answer that question? And yes, lava still blocks the road to the MLO. As for Haleakala, you can't drive there from Puna, and they don't have a recent lava flow blocking the road to the summit. But what does "the drive from Puna compared to MLO" mean?

https://www.hawaiitribune-herald.com/202...servatory/

[ironyak]

TomK - It's not uncommon for snow to fall on Haleakala's summit [I've bolded the topic of this sentence - keep it in mind going forward]

Yak - Yeah, NWS says it [snowfall on Haleakala's summit, see above] averages once a season every couple years. The real question though [in regards to the topic, snowfall on Haleakala's summit, remember?] is how's the drive from Puna [as] compared to [the drive to] MLO [from Puna, obviously] - better, worse, or about the same (in the "you can't get there from here" sorta way ;)?

Those squiggles before the question mark are a winking smiley face, denoting humor, because, of course, both sites cannot be accessed via a drive from Puna, as they are both blocked, one by a lava flow (which you already brought up days ago) and the other an ocean channel (which is common knowledge for those living here). ha ha ha?

Maybe, let's try this instead - might provide some explanations. You're in a desert, walking along in the sand, when all of a sudden you look down and see a tortoise. (You know what a turtle is? Same thing.) You reach down and you flip the tortoise over on its back. The tortoise lays on its back, its belly baking in the hot sun, beating its legs trying to turn itself over, but it can't. Not without your help. But you're not helping. Why is that?

Apt description for climate change actually - planetary ecological systems flipped upside down and flailing, but not being helped. Why is that...

[TomK]

You can babble on. The fact is "The real question though is how's the drive from Puna compared to MLO - better, worse, or about the same (in the "you can't get there from here" sorta way?" is impossible to answer because it makes no sense.