DHHL meetings on geothermal energy exploration

[randomq]

Do the other islands get a lot of earthquakes and eruptions that would preclude modern failsafe nuclear designs?

Maybe a moot point if all the islands have enough geothermal and solar to cover their needs. Though in the Punatic spirit I'd rather have my own independent 1000w nuclear battery in the back yard.

[ironyak]

Total number of Small Modular Reactors currently operating: 2 (one in China and one in Russia).
Cost for the Wyoming project: $4+ billion, roughly 10x per watt generated compared to utility scale solar with storage.
The fact that some think this is money well-spent and an appropriate technology for Hawai'i which has many other more affordable power options: Priceless.

MM - So, by my measure, having DHHL stand up and lead the charge for geothermal is perfect. ... it’s up to sane adult Hawaiians to sort the wheat from the chaff
While I appreciate much of your summary is lived history, I have to wonder if it all was, and is, as simple as your summary makes it out to be. I think about the 1978 Hilo Airport protest, and others like it, as reminders that what the DHHL state agency wants, and what the beneficiaries want, often times do not align. This sort of disconnect between commercial development and the long history of failing to actually put Hawai'ians in homes on those DHHL lands is very likely going to be front and center again for the discussion around geothermal development.

[MyManao]

This sort of disconnect between commercial development and the long history of failing to actually put Hawai'ians in homes on those DHHL lands is very likely going to be front and center again for the discussion around geothermal development.

While I agree with you 100%, DHHL’s history is a train wreck, I think it’s only fair to point out that as a state agency they have been saddled with the same dysfunctions as their overlords, who have denied them their rightful funding and hobbled their efforts to rise above the fray at every turn. And, only now, has anything been done to rectify the situation, and treat them with the respect their station is due.

With this in mind, and the knowledge that they aren’t going anywhere, I think it is incumbent upon us all to look forward to better days ahead. 

The same holds true for state. What a screwed up government we have. But still it is the one we have. And, with each new election, with each passing legislature session, we engage, or not, and can either whine about it all or try to steer it towards becoming its better self.

As such, we can harp on the good ol’ days when dying on the DHHL’s wait list was a right of passage, or recognize that with the current efforts to straighten out their funding, and hopefully with that their rightful place in our system of governance, that there is lots of room to hope they themselves will select stewards that will better serve their constituents going forward.

As Marshall McLuhan pointed out, it's difficult to drive forward while looking in the rearview mirror.

[TomK]

This sort of disconnect between commercial development and the long history of failing to actually put Hawai'ians in homes on those DHHL lands is very likely going to be front and center again for the discussion around geothermal development.

While I agree with you 100%, DHHL’s history is a train wreck, I think it’s only fair to point out that as a state agency they have been saddled with the same dysfunctions as their overlords, who have denied them their rightful funding and hobbled their efforts to rise above the fray at every turn. And, only now, has anything been done to rectify the situation, and treat them with the respect their station is due. [...]

(Bolding is mine)

Sometimes it's hard to pin down someone's opinion.

"So, by my measure, having DHHL stand up and lead the charge for geothermal is perfect. Now instead of the state being the bad guy and having to contend with the ignorant fools who jump up and down screaming about how they know better than anyone else what “Pele” wants, it’s up to sane adult Hawaiians to sort the wheat from the chaff. And, I trust that they will be able to. After all, those whack jobs that have nothing better to do than spew gibberish on the socials will be seen for what they are and we’ll all move on."

Couldn't say that last bit better myself. What does Pele want? Do you know the answer to that better than anyone else? Why does someone who moved to the islands from California think they can speak for some mythical Hawaiian deity?

[ironyak]

MyManao - As Marshall McLuhan pointed out, it's difficult to drive forward while looking in the rearview mirror.

Not to get too off-track, but I think McLuhan's "We look at the present through a rear-view mirror. We march backwards into the future." was a bit more all encompassing of the limitations of human experience, rather than just a choice of perspective that creates difficulties. Not sure we can even choose to face the future headlong as we understand all our experiences only in retrospect, based on our past. As that other great media presence once said about where things are heading - "Difficult to see. Always in motion is the future." ;)

Regardless, the first of the Geothermal Informational Briefings is tonight on Moloka’i @ 6:30 p.m. Haven't seen a zoom link yet so may have to wait for news and video to get posted, which we'll have to look back on and try to make sense of it all, only after the fact.

https://dhhl.hawaii.gov/meetings/

[TomK]

Not to get too off-track, but I think McLuhan's "We look at the present through a rear-view mirror. We march backwards into the future." was a bit more all encompassing of the limitations of human experience, rather than just a choice of perspective that creates difficulties. Not sure we can even choose to face the future headlong as we understand all our experiences only in retrospect, based on our past. As that other great media presence once said about where things are heading - "Difficult to see. Always in motion is the future."

That's a lot of words, but to me, they say very little. What point are you trying to make? To me, both you and MyManao write a lot of stuff that makes little sense to a normal, rational person. For instance:

"We march backwards into the future." was a bit more all encompassing of the limitations of human experience"

Seems meaningless to me unless you have some experience of what it's like to live beyond human experience, and I suspect that's very unlikely. So it's just a bunch of meaningless words put together to sound cool at a hippie convention and little to do with reality.

[MyManao]

Not to get too off-track, but I think McLuhan's "We look at the present through a rear-view mirror. We march backwards into the future." was a bit more all encompassing of the limitations of human experience, rather than just a choice of perspective that creates difficulties.

Yes, regardless of scale, Marshall's work still rings true.. even more so than in its formative years. It's a shame everyone didn't get that lesson. Didn't get exposed to and take to heart what he was pointing out. For me, I think, it was my 9th grade English class that introduced me to The Medium Is the Message. Even now. AI doesn't rush forward but rather catalogs and regurgitates the past.

And, although it's a little dated, (isn't everything these days?) Andrew Prescott's Keynote talk to the Digital Editing Now conference at CRASSH, University of Cambridge, 7–9 January 2016, titled Avoiding the Rear View Mirror, which starts out saying..

I have taken my title today from one of the most famous aphorisms of Marshall McLuhan. McLuhan pointed out how, in using new technologies, our vision is restricted by our previous experience. We do not immediately grasp the potential of new technologies but interpret them in the light of what we know. McLuhan called this effect ‘the rear view mirror’..

Does make a number of salient points.

[TomK]

And, although it's a little dated, (isn't everything these days?) Andrew Prescott's Keynote talk to the Digital Editing Now conference at CRASSH, University of Cambridge, 7–9 January 2016, titled Avoiding the Rear View Mirror, which starts out saying..

From https://medium.com/digital-transformatio...0319290bb2

"In this context, it is difficult to escape the suspicion that the metaphor of the digital edition is also driven by the rear view mirror. This certainly seems to be the case in the way in which our online editions follow canonical forms, focussing on major works such as the Canterbury Tales or Beowulf or canonical authors as Ben Jonson or Jane Austen. It is striking that, where funding is available for conventional printed editions of authors such as Shakespeare, Wordsworth or Robert Burns, this is preferred, as if the digital edition is somehow second-best or the preserve of geeky enthusiasts. The innovative components of digital editions, such as the incorporation of images, are done in comparatively crude fashion, perhaps reflecting our uncertainty as to where facsimiles sit in terms of editorial practice, as Kathryn discussed yesterday. Is our attachment to the idea of the edition itself an example of marching backwards into the future?"

Then, from  https://medium.com/@Ajprescott/keynote-l...fb56d25980

"It was Chaucer who first taught me that it can be very, very difficult to get to Aberystwyth. In October 2000, the new digital facsimile of the Hengwrt manuscript of the Canterbury Tales published by Peter Robinson’s Scholarly Digital Editions and edited by Estelle Stubbs was launched here in the National Library. I had seen a preview of the new CD and the whole package seemed to me to set an important new benchmark in the production of digital resources: the digital images shot by the National Library were among the best images of a medieval manuscript I had yet seen, and the transcription and introduction by Estelle Stubbs were superb. So I was keen to toast this splendid achievement. But Virgin Trains had other ideas. I had pre-ordered my ticket to Aberystwyth and went to Euston for the first leg of the trip to mid Wales. The first train was cancelled, so I resigned myself to being two hours late. I returned to the ticket barrier two hours later only to be assured that my ticket was not valid for Aberystwyth. It was valid on the next Aberystwyth service, but certainly not on that one. A four hours delay was enough to ensure that I would miss the launch of the CD, so I gave up, and sent my best wishes for the launch instead." 

It seems he's a fan of English literature, but I'm struggling to figure out what the point is or how it's relevant here. Chaucer didn't even know Hawaii existed. This is the main reason I chose to go into physical sciences. There's a lot of guff to get through in this old literature, second-guessing what authors meant and trying to interpret their words. And I don't need Chaucer to tell me how difficult it can be to get to Aberystwyth. You can just look at a map.

[ironyak]

Haven't seen any info about the meeting in Moloka'i yet, but the 13th Annual Hawaii Energy Conference is also going on the next couple days (May 20 - 21) on Maui, which also has an geothermal and indigenous focus so all this is likely part of the full court push. There appears to be something for everyone at the conference though, from resilience and microgrids, to permitting, to Sustʻāinable Molokai, to LNG (with guest appearance from JERA of course).

Have to see if any of the talks end up being shared with the masses - maybe reach out to Iligan, whose a panelist, to see what he can share as well.

https://hawaiienergyconference.com/wp-co...rogram.pdf
"From geothermal in Hawaii to energy projects on tribal lands and cooperative models across the U.S. and New Zealand, participants will share experiences and strategies for advancing energy solutions while maintaining harmony with local landscapes and traditions."

[TomK]

Haven't seen any info about the meeting in Moloka'i yet, but the 13th Annual Hawaii Energy Conference is also going on the next couple  days (May 20 - 21) on Maui, which also has an geothermal and indigenous focus so all this is likely part of the full court push. [...]

Please let us know when it happens.