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loophole in the plastic bag ban laws?
#1
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/07/10...50112.html

Funny, I don't remember anyone giving me a free reusable plastic bag! Where is mine? Oh that's right, we don't live Oahu.

I also find it interesting that the Chinese Store is still using and selling plastic bags. Matter of fact, it's the only store I know on the big island that still sells plastic bags for a nickel.

I always buy one when we shop, it does say biodegradable on them and they are indeed bigger and thicker bag, kinda nice really. I wonder if they too are using the loophole?
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#2
the loophole will effectively undermine the ban

I'm sure this was totally unintentional and nobody saw it coming.

I can act surprised if that helps.
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#3
I'm wondering why the rest of the outer islands aren't using the loophole yet?
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#4
the rest of the outer islands

Plastic bag ban is per-County, but only Oahu has the cash-flow necessary for a legislative loophole.
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#5
"If it looks like the bag is made of plastic, that's because it is. And, according to experts, these thicker, "reusable" bags are actually worse for the environment than the flimsy, single-use bags used before the ban. "

AWESOME.
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#6
Lets face it... the flimsy paper bags we get can't be reused. I'm lucky if they make it to the car without ripping. Paper bags take far more energy (petroleum) to produce than plastic bags and paper lasts just as long in a landfill than plastic. The only thing the plastic bag ban does is cause me to go buy plastic bags to replace the ones I was reusing from shopping to line my waste baskets. Oh, and it makes greenies feel good about banning a product and replacing it with a different one that requires both the cutting down of trees AND the burning of even more petroleum to produce. Well played greenies... well played.

Here's an article for environmental extremists to begin debunking. Blame it on fox news as you counter:

Paper Versus Plastic: Environmental Disadvantages of Each

When you do get to choose between paper and plastic, don't let green guilt necessarily pull you toward paper. Consider that both materials have drawbacks for the environment.

­Before you brown bag it, consider these environmental disadvantages of paper:
•Causes pollution: Paper production emits air pollution, specifically 70 percent more pollution than the production of plastic bags [source: Thompson]. According to certain studies, manufacturing paper emits 80 percent more greenhouse gases [source: Lilienfield]. And, consider that making paper uses trees that, instead, could be absorbing carbon dioxide. The paper bag making process also results in 50 times more water pollutants than making plastic bags [source: Thompson].
•Consumes energy: Even though petroleum goes into making plastic, it turns out that making a paper bag consumes four times as much energy as making a plastic bag, meaning making paper consumes a good deal of fuel [source: reusablebags.com].
•Consumes water: The production of paper bags uses three times the amount of water it takes to make plastic bags [source: Lilienfield].
•Inefficient recycling: The process of recycling paper can be inefficient -- often consuming more fuel than it would take to make a new bag [source: Milstein]. In addition, it takes about 91 percent more energy to recycle a pound of paper than a pound of plastic [source: reusablebags.com].
•Produces waste: According to some measures, paper bags generate 80 percent more solid waste [source: Lilienfield].
•Biodegrading difficulties: Surprisingly, the EPA has stated that in landfills, paper doesn't degrade all that much faster than plastics [source: Lilienfield].


However, plastic didn't get a bad reputation for nothing. Here are some environmental disadvantages of plastic:

Many stores offer bins for properly recycling old plastic bags.

•­Danger to wildlife: Plastic waste is deceptive for birds and other wildlife, who mistake it for food. And you can imagine how eating plastic messes with an animal's intestine. As a result, animals can die of starvation [source: Spivey]. To prevent this, perhaps paper is the better choice, especially if you live on the coast, as your plastic waste is more likely to make its way to marine life and sea birds [source: Thompson].
•Long-term degrading: Light breaks plastic down so it photodegrades rather than biodegrades. Estimates say that this process can take up to 500 or even 1000 years in landfills [source: Lapidos]. Unfortunately, we don't really know, as plastic is a relatively new invention.
•Recycling difficulties: Although for the most part, plastic takes less energy to recycle than paper, plastic bags are a frustrating recycling dilemma. The curbside recycling in many communities is not meant for plastic bags because they can screw up the plant's machines [source: Milstein]. Instead, some stores offer bins in which to properly recycle plastic bags.

These factors have made the question of which is greener mind-boggling. The EPA has admitted that not only is the question unresolved, but it doesn't consider the use of plastic bags a major issue [source: Spivey]. Most environmental groups say that it's best to avoid the choice altogether -- instead we should diligently reuse bags.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/environ...astic1.htm
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#7
why not get in the habit of bringing along a reusable bag made from fabric instead. but then, yes, the problem remains of what to use for rubbish bags at home. though i do suspect bags purchased specifically for rubbish don't end up blowing down the street and into streams as often as plastic bags from convenience stores did.


long-term degrading:

isn't photodegradation of plastic the very slow process of fragmenting into smaller pieces of plastic without breaking into simpler compounds? tiny particles of plastic which can then harmfully accumulate in the food chain?

the article could be taken to not fully take into account that very long term problem.
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#8
Maybe the answer is addressing the subject scientifically rather than because of the real reason for the ban on SOME plastic bags: stray plastic bags are unsightly.
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#9
no objection here to addressing the subject scientifically. but i was unaware that the "real reason" for the ban on some plastic bags was simply because stray plastic are unsightly. now that's not setting a very good example of addressing the subject scientifically, free from opinionated bias.
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#10
The biodegradable bags aren't utilizing any loophole in the law. They just aren't plastic. Many of them are made from plant starches and vegetable oils (corn products) and will start to degrade if they get wet.
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