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The History of the overthrow told by Hawaiians
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08-03-2015, 04:16 AM
With the way the building codes are changing its going to further push people to build without permits. Just the new footing requirements are ridiculous. And the inspectors are accountable to no one.
One Thing I can always be sure of is that things will never go as expected.
08-03-2015, 05:49 AM
quote: That's a good comparative and the Pacific Menehune to be the Atlantic Skræling.
08-03-2015, 06:01 AM
Menehune is a name given by the Hawaiian peoples as Hawaiian is a given name through Western influence via Kamehameha's line.
Skraeling is a given name by the Norsk peoples of the Inuit peoples. Here's something to chew on. What is the correct name for the "Hawaiian" people? Is Hawaiian only applicable to those native people from the Big Island and what is the proper name for the Menehune? Can "Hawaiian" history books answer those questions for us? What's the straight scoop before the multi cultural clouds scrambled everything? 
08-05-2015, 05:09 AM
Aloha kakahiaka all.
This thread's title (..."told by Hawaiians") prompts me to post this article below: (*Snipped - More at link) On November 20, 1892, U.S. Diplomat John Stevens assigned to Hawai‘i stated in a confidential dispatch to U.S. Secretary of State John Foster, we must “Americanize the islands, assume control of the ‘Crown lands,’ dispose of them in small lots for actual settlers and freeholders for the raising of coffee, oranges, lemons, bananas, pineapples, and grapes, and the result soon will be to give permanent preponderance to a population and a civilization which will make the islands like southern California, and at no distant period convert them into gardens and sanitariums, as well as supply stations for American commerce, thus bringing everything here into harmony with American life and prosperity. To postpone American action many years is only to add to present unfavorable tendencies and to make future possession more difficult.” After seizing the Hawaiian Islands during the Spanish-American War, the United States initiated a formal policy of denationalization through Americanization throughout the Hawaiian Kingdom’s public schools system. Private schools followed the policy. In 1906, the formal policy was initiated to not only obliterate the national consciousness of the Hawaiian Kingdom in the minds of the children, but to also conceal the blatant violation of Hawai‘i’s sovereignty as a neutral state and the international law of occupation. This program was called “Programme for Patriotic Exercises in the Public Schools.” The purpose of the program was to inculcate American patriotism in the minds of the children and forced them to speak English and not Hawaiian. http://hawaiiankingdom.org/blog/denation...anization/ (*Posted without personal opinion included to avoid any unwarranted, unnecessary confrontational discussion.) This is a part of what the current "revolution" is all about. The "mantra" includes, the words of our Queen, "Onipa'a", "We are silent no more.", "We are awakened", "EA"! Ua Mau Ke Ea O ka Aina I ka Pono. "The life of the land is perpetuated in righteousness" Of note, in Washington D.C., there are continued negotiations going on to approve the status of "tribe" for Hawaiians, with proposed consessions almost mirroring the agreements with the "American" Indian tribes. FWIW/JMO.
08-05-2015, 05:34 AM
This article has a skeptical approach to the whole tribal concept. I don't know the author's qualifications, but he does at least quote federal administrative law and gives his source material:
http://www.law.com/sites/jamesching/2014...0705152502 Here's a snip from it: Hawaii, then, seems to present a difficult problem for the Interior Department simply based on Hawaiian political and social history. It is not clear that Native Hawaiians would meet the stringent objective Part 83 criteria, among which are mandatory criteria relating to dealings with others as a unified political group while maintaining a large degree of cultural and social unity. (25 CFR section 83.7) Such rigorous cultural and social criteria define the cohesion for a Native government and its political identity throughout Part 38. Federal acceptance of a Native government is no longer a matter of subjective testimony about individual identification. For example, the following are indicative of “political influence or authority over its members as an autonomous entity from historical times until the present” for a Native American community: “(i) More than 50 percent of the members reside in a geographical area exclusively or almost exclusively composed of members of the group, and the balance of the group maintains consistent interaction with some members of the community; (ii) At least 50 percent of the marriages in the group are between members of the group; (iii) At least 50 percent of the group members maintain distinct cultural patterns such as, but not limited to, language, kinship organization, or religious beliefs and practices; (iv) There are distinct community social institutions encompassing most of the members, such as kinship organizations, formal or informal economic cooperation, or religious organizations . . . “ (25 CFR section 88.7©(1)) I don't know enough to agree or disagree with his contentions, but he does give pause for thought.
08-05-2015, 05:34 AM
Of note, in Washington D.C., there are continued negotiations going on to approve the status of "tribe" for Hawaiians, with proposed consessions almost mirroring the agreements with the "American" Indian tribes.
Both the Hawaiians and Native Americans started meeting years ago to assist the Hawaiians in following the same or similar pathway.
08-05-2015, 07:59 AM
quote:The context of the above shows a lot of scrambling. Menehune is menehune, there is no "known as". Even though the Micronesians were conquered by the Tongans, and the Tongans were conquered by the first Tahitians, and the second group of Tahitians conquered those, there was still an oral history of the Menehune and they all acknowledge Menehune were here first, at least on Kauai. Hawaii moku is Hawaii because it was the first island that Ha landed at and named. There is a big scrambling going on with even pronouncing Hawaii, with a growing group saying the 'w' is pronounced like German 'v'. Whoever is doing this is totally screwed up. In all the discussions that turn into arguments, nobody ever references the Cook voyages as being the defining reference of pre-contact Hawaii. This was a time, after the American Revolutionary war, that the British started realizing their past two hundred years of conquest was wiping out whole cultures, so Cook had royal orders to document everything before destroying it. There are massive amounts of reference materials and nobody seems to pay attention that Cook on his return voyage met up with a sister ship, and those naturalists and artists produced thousands of documents and drawings, capturing pre-contact Hawaii. One entry shows what they heard when they asked the natives what the name of the place was. It was written down in separate journals. The fact they heard Ou-why-ee and wrote it that way proves there was no 'v' sound. Reading their journals of Hawaii island are hilarious, they found it rather hideous which probably was the early indicator for Cook's demise. Notice also what he called the native. "The same day, wrote David Samwell, surgeon on the Discovery, "we stood to the Westward for the Land, having weathered the most easterly point of Ou-why-ee, at 5 in the afternoon saw the Land right a head." Still aboard was the native who had been unable to get ashore since he came aboard the ship on 23rd December. However, the next day "we were close in with the Land… a great number of Canoes came off to us… a few of the Indians came on board but could give us no intelligence of the Resolution… Many people collected on the Beach to look at the Ship. Our Indian Guest… packed a few things together which had been given to him and went ashore… About 2 o'Clock in the Afternoon we saw some appearance of a Harbour, upon which we brought the Ship to & sent the great Cutter ashore to examine it… About 5 o'Clock the Boat returned having found no Harbour." "Aloha also means goodbye. Aloha!"
*Japanese tourist on bus through Pahoa, "Is this still America?*
08-05-2015, 12:00 PM
Some of his published journals are available electronically for free on Project Gutenberg
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/search/?...ptain+cook But I don't think Hawaii is included. I've seen a book of his journey to Hawaii, but I think it was told by another crew member. Perhaps because he didn't make it home. quote: ><(((*< ... ><(("< ... ><('< ... >o>
08-05-2015, 01:51 PM
quote:I would be curious to know who is negotiating on behalf of the Hawaiians and under what authority. With several competing ideas and entities out there claiming to represent them, how do Hawaiians know who's legit? |
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