Ohia trees are dying rapidly, Why?

[leilanidude]

My understanding is they are added to the wells for various reasons that vent into atmosphere of the surrounding communities.
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Your "understanding" is incorrect. There is no venting into the atmosphere of the surrounding communities.

They do add some specific chemicals into the return brine that goes back into the geothermal reservoir, thousands of feet down, well below any water table.

[kalakoa]

The current alternative to geothermal in Hawaii is fossil fuels

I'm always amazed that the anti-geothermal folks seem to forget this -- it's difficult to see how geothermal can have a worse environmental impact than burning oil (which is, itself, shipped here by burning more oil).

meeting baseload energy demand during non sunny/windy periods

Part of the problem (which nobody bothers to address) is that unlike all other commodities, power is generated to meet real-time demand. Install some battery buffer (eg, Tesla Powerwall), this makes local solar more useful and simplifies the grid management -- fewer peaks means better utilization of the baseload source, and baseload sources tend to be more efficient than peak sources.

some specific chemicals into the return brine that goes back into the geothermal reservoir

I believe those chemicals are a proprietary trade secret, just like with fracking...

[Punatic007]

Some of you folks are so pro-geothermal to the point of denying it's drawbacks and dangers to the neighboring communities. First and foremost it's in the wrong location. The lack of empathy here is disturbing. How would you like to be denied sleep for weeks and months at a time by nighttime drilling accompanied by your house vibrating?

Are you saying the highly toxic anti-corrosives are no longer poured into the wells? Are you saying there are no possibilities of malfunctions and blow outs? I admit I have not followed all the details of the changes of technology implemented however were there not huge issues of a toxic release during Iselle?

Residents have won lawsuits against PGV. And Harry Kim the former mayor and head of civil defense says after all he and other professionals have experienced first hand with Puna geothermal heavy industry it is NOT safe for neighboring communities. He has spoken out against it numerous times including media interviews.

And you guys here on punaweb go on and on about how great it is? Come on...

Not even a little middle ground...just how great it is?

[kalakoa]

First and foremost it's in the wrong location.

Don't blame PGV for the big Hawaiian land scams of the 50s and 60s, especially in the case of Leilani, which should never have been subdivided on an active Zone 1 rift.

That said, can anyone suggest a better location for geothermal? Oh, that's right, all possible locations for any develoment are in Someone's Backyard.

[Justin]

Agreed - the location more or less picked itself. As I stated before with regards to occasional SO2 in the air around PGV, the steam isn't there because of PGV, PGV is there because of the steam. It's akin to arguing that oil wells should be in the middle of Utah instead of along the coast in California and Alaska.

And as to middle ground, I do acknowledge that there were malfunctions back in 1991. But that was 24 years ago, and to my knowledge, not a single person died directly from that event. I can tell you that I'd hate for someone to continually bring up an unfortunate event from my past two dozen years after he fact. In those 24 years, I guarantee you that there have been hundreds or thousands of deaths in the oil, gas, coal industry.

[leilanidude]

Punatic007 - Would you rather have an oil tanker run aground and spill oil all down the coastline because that is most likely, inevitable if we continue to ship this much oil here to be used simply for producing electricity.

[pbmaise]

If Ohia are sensitive/stressed by imaginary emissions, they should also show stress at actual sites of emmission.

The ohia trees at the steamvents lived just fine in a near constant mist of gas coming from below. They would not have grown there if the emissions were bad. Go up to the summit and walk the trail along Iki Caldera and view huge ohia that survive fine too. They survived right next to a giant lava eruption.

So refocus please on the actual cause of death

fungus


and focus on vectors

Vectors are how fungus gets in.

A. Root system?
B. Bark beetles?
C. Carpenter bees?

Is there a new vector?
A. LFA?
B. Rotting strawberry guava fruit?
C. Pigs digging up root systems?
D. New bark beetle?

Is population of vector out of check?
A. Low kikiki huna population?
B. Coqui frog changed ecosystem?

[Opihikaobob]

quote:

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Originally posted by Punatic007

Some of you folks are so pro-geothermal to the point of denying it's drawbacks and dangers to the neighboring communities. First and foremost it's in the wrong location. The lack of empathy here is disturbing. How would you like to be denied sleep for weeks and months at a time by nighttime drilling accompanied by your house vibrating?

Are you saying the highly toxic anti-corrosives are no longer poured into the wells? Are you saying there are no possibilities of malfunctions and blow outs? I admit I have not followed all the details of the changes of technology implemented however were there not huge issues of a toxic release during Iselle?

Residents have won lawsuits against PGV. And Harry Kim the former mayor and head of civil defense says after all he and other professionals have experienced first hand with Puna geothermal heavy industry it is NOT safe for neighboring communities. He has spoken out against it numerous times including media interviews.

And you guys here on punaweb go on and on about how great it is? Come on...

Not even a little middle ground...just how great it is?




"were there not huge issues of a toxic release during Iselle?"

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ABSOLUTELY , with regards to text above, but don't waste your time with leilanidude ,or pahoated , rainyjim as they are compromised in some fashion - maybe they subscribe to "Round up is so safe you can drink it"

edited 4 times for , cause it just wouldn't go where I pointed it

[Hawaii Bound]

Harry Kim was all Pro PGV when he was in office and head of Civil Defense.

He didn't became anti PGV until he decided to run for office again. Hmmm, coincidence that he thought he would get sufficient votes from the anti PGV people to put him in office that he conveniently became anti-PGV?!

What he didn't realize is that the anti PGV folks are an EXTREMELLY vocal minority. They just seem larger than what they are because of how obnoxious they are with their message.

[pbmaise]

Isnt this thread about ohia trees? The idea of the geo-plant being any factor in rapid death caused by a fungus has been dismissed as extremely remote. Meanwhile harping on something remotely possible dilutes conversation regarding known vectors. After eliminating far more likely causes, the cause is still unkown, then you look more closely at those causes with only a tiny chance.

So if your goal is to prove geothermal, first prove other causes are not the reason.