HPP road maintainence

[My 2 cents]

quote:

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Originally posted by kalakoa

Not the best option because the community still needs representation for issues other than the roads.

How effective is the current representation?

I'll elaborate: no HOA should be in charge of any infrastructure, road maintenance needs to be driven by a professional management corporation who acts as a disinterested third party to implement a simple objective ("maintain the roads").

The (volunteer or otherwise) HOA should be dealing with things like "what color to paint the community center" and "meet with our County Council representative".

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I think we are in agreement. Getting out of the road business is priority 1, but representation for other things like "meet with our County Council representative", commercial development, and yes, even mailboxes is still important. And I think the board could handle these issues much more easily and efficiently if the infrastructure obligation is removed.

[mermaid53]

Tom, that was funny. Good comic relief.

quote:

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Originally posted by reni
WE NEED PROFESSIONAL MANAGEMENT.....FOR THE REASON OUR ASSOC. EXISTS..... OUR ROADS. You have given so much of your energy towards making things right but this is just nuts!! I doubt this board has the legal right to assess us for p.o. boxes but it's like, who cares about the law any more in this society????? 3 of us????
$150.00 per owner will mushroom into what? and the cluster continues.

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As suggested sometime ago after prof'l mgmt was discussed over and over...who's going to show up at the next membership mtg and form a committee to research this option? Will you? Talking on PT about it isn't going to take us there. Form a committee and get back to the membership w/your findings...then take an intial vote. After, a ballot would have to go out to all the members w/the details and tallied by a 3rd party.

The ball won't start rolling until someone takes that first step... I'm sure there'll be interested members to join such a committee. There's a lot of smart HPP people who can contribute to this research. With a bylaw committee currently working, if any laws have to be changed in conjunction w/a mgmt co, that can be done.

The bond stipulates the existence of a board. If in receivership, (another option many have spoken about) the board will still have to be in place...although castrated to some extent.

Kalakoa, I appreciate your input...but Who has the $ to sue the county? And HPP's bond may interfere w/some of your suggestions....sue board for misappropriation of money... again who has the $? The board IS being sued...two and half yrs later and still going strong and we're lining the attys pockets nicely...and still no board accountability after all this time.

Most reps would have learned from that 1st mistake once served w/a lawsuit but these unusually arrogant bylaw breaking reps continue their recklessness w/our $ and our roads = no accountability...water off a duck's back, think they're above the law, spending OUR $$$ for attorneys to bolster their position. This is an extreme abuse of power...and has all the markings of a dictatorship.

Reps should be excused temporarily from the board once they're served w/a lawsuit. We've had a serious conflict of interest from that point on. That's where our troubles began and still lie. Still driving the car recklessly w/all of us as passengers.

[kalakoa]

but Who has the $ to sue the county?

HPPOA has money for a new grader, chip-seal, and a mass-mailing demanding mailbox fees... but since that money "isn't available" for actual governance:

- convince the Feds to sue County over failed CDP process
- everyone contest their property tax valuation as a massive "civil disobedience"

who's going to show up at the next membership mtg and form a committee to research this option?

Completely missing the point: rogue board will prevent the committee from forming and/or ignore any results. The only workable solutions will have to come from outside the rogue board.

[Chunkster]

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
Albert Einstein

Mermaid, I respect your multiple efforts over the years to improve HPP, but forming yet another committee, doing yet another by-laws revision, attending just one more meeting, or trying one more time to elect some decent board members is not going to help. The fundamental problem with the HPPOA is what several other people have said, i.e., the whole thing is beyond what a volunteer board can handle.

I ponied up $100 for the arbitration process as a last resort to try to work within the current framework, but the earnest and well-meaning people who spearheaded the arbitration blew it. They went once to see a lawyer who took their consultation fee and told them he couldn't work with them due to past involvement with the hui. Instead of seeing another attorney, they proceeded without one and lost on a technicality to the board which had plenty of legal representation.

I am prepared to contribute again, but only if the objective is to place the whole mess into court supervised receivership pending its dissolution or replacement from the ground up with appointed outside directors. This will require legal action. Surely there is an attorney living in HPP who is fed up with the craziness and would help with this. If not, then we need to raise the necessary money to do it. I will chip in.

I could regale you all with five pages of the sorry history going back through the 15 years I have been involved in the HPPOA, but let's just say that self government for HPP has been an abject failure. The system is broken and needs to be replaced from the ground up.

[kalakoa]

dissolution or replacement from the ground up with appointed outside directors

There is one other option provided by HCC: create a "special improvement district" which effectively puts County in charge of collecting payments via property tax rider, with said money to be spent on designated improvements.

I almost hate to say it, but I'm not sure County could do any worse than HPPOA.

[Obie]

"but Who has the $ to sue the county?"

What are you suing them for ? If you read the Hawaii County Code you will see that paved roads were not required until 1966.I believe HPP was subdivided well before that.

http://www.hawaiicounty.gov/lb-file-revi...pter23.pdf

Scroll down to section 23-86.

.

[mermaid53]

Originally posted by Chunkster

Mermaid, I respect your multiple efforts over the years to improve HPP, but forming yet another committee, doing yet another by-laws revision, attending just one more meeting, or trying one more time to elect some decent board members is not going to help. The fundamental problem with the HPPOA is what several other people have said, i.e., the whole thing is beyond what a volunteer board can handle.

A number of members who post on here say property mgmt is the way to go and I agree...but how does that get launched w/out a committee researching A-Z first? Doesn't have to be an HPPOA committee per se but a group of interested lot owners coming together. I have no plans to spearhead this but will support it...so who's going to do it?

I am prepared to contribute again, but only if the objective is to place the whole mess into court supervised receivership pending its dissolution or replacement from the ground up with appointed outside directors. This will require legal action. Surely there is an attorney living in HPP who is fed up with the craziness and would help with this. If not, then we need to raise the necessary money to do it. I will chip in.

Will you do the foot work to find an atty in HPP, possibly pro bono? You say "we need to raise the necessary money to do it", so who's going to spearhead that? Who's WE?

I could regale you all with five pages of the sorry history going back through the 15 years I have been involved in the HPPOA, but let's just say that self government for HPP has been an abject failure. The system is broken and needs to be replaced from the ground up.

I agree. But again, who's going to spearhead fixing this broken system from the ground up? Isn't that the failure here as well that no one comes forward to spearhead all these good ideas?

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
Albert Einstein

I like this one better: "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke

Both quotes apply... Nothing will change unless people take action, not just talk about it ("same thing over and over again and expecting different results")

At least the BLC is taking action. Not only does the board look for gray areas in our bylaws but so does their attys...

[kalakoa]

paved roads were not required until 1966

Before which, the Planning Commission was able to grant variances from the paving requirement. Let's not pretend that County had nothing to do with these substandard subdivisions.

[Obie]

quote:

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Originally posted by kalakoa

paved roads were not required until 1966

Before which, the Planning Commission was able to grant variances from the paving requirement. Let's not pretend that County had nothing to do with these substandard subdivisions.

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Right they did allow variances but that does not make them liable for paving all of these dirt roads.The variances were allowed because the developers didn't have the money to pave and that responsibility was passed on to the future owners of the lots.Everyone living on a dirt road got a big discount on the price of that lot and they need to acknowledge that fact and quit crying.

[Chunkster]

@Mermaid: I have made some calls and started some chains of contact. Hopefully something will come of it, and I will post if and when it happens.