Posts: 14,116
Threads: 424
Joined: Aug 2012
It would be worth knowing if our Homeowner's Policies cover theft and/or misuse of a owned firearm.
Homeowner insurance is not available for unpermitted dwellings.
Put another way, it makes a much less sense for city dwellers to be allowed to have concealed carry permits and handguns than it does for a rural dweller to have a hunting rifle.
Congratulations: you've just discovered the Canadian system. Anyone can have a long gun, handguns are nearly impossible, no concealed carry. Maybe it's just the regulations, maybe it's different societal attitudes, but they don't seem to have any mass shootings up there.
This is America. Money is the driving force of everything it seems.
Exactly: if the insurance lobby can outspend the gun lobby, we'll get mandatory gun insurance, whether or not it's an effective solution. Just like that mandatory health insurance.
Posts: 604
Threads: 50
Joined: Apr 2009
I think all firearms that are basically designed to kill as many people as possible should be completely banned. I also think that we need a background check that interviews a half dozen or so of people who know the individual should be interviewed. Killed animals for the thrill? Threatened neighbors? Things like that may never show up in a police report. Do a buy back. Insurance sounds like a plan.
Peace and long life
Peace and long life
Posts: 1,085
Threads: 10
Joined: Aug 2016
if the insurance lobby can outspend the gun lobby
This is a lawmaker's dream.
Posts: 1,120
Threads: 57
Joined: Mar 2013
Whatever strategy is brought to bear, it should focus more on gun manufacture and distribution than possession. The 2nd amendment's right to gun ownership seems to confer the right to make your own guns. But I do not think it confers the right to set up a large factory or become a gun seller.
Consider our handling of illegal drugs. We have long treated sale or manufacture as a different matter (and more egregious) than possession. In many places we tolerate marijuana use but make no provision for people to buy it.
It makes sense to have an insurance requirement attached to gun sales.
Gun control will come largely state by state. Hawaii could put an insurance requirement on all gun sales. Some mainland states might do so only for the AR-15 and similar high capacity weapons (as opposed to single shot hunting rifles and shotguns.)
An insurance requirement will make people think a bit more as to whether they really need a gun--or 4 or 5 of them.
Posts: 14,116
Threads: 424
Joined: Aug 2012
In many places we tolerate marijuana use but make no provision for people to buy it.
Is that anything like tolerating gun ownership but making no provision for a safe place to practice using them?
Posts: 664
Threads: 67
Joined: Mar 2016
No, the opposite would be the same. Having gun ranges but not allowing people to buy guns. And this model is actually something that happens in some countries. For example a club or a private company can own weapons, but not citizens. How this works is you go to the shooting range and "rent" the gun. Or you go to a "hunting event" and use the clubs gun. In these cases the companies are highly regulated and have strict requirements for whom they can "rent" or "loan" to and where and when they can do so.
Posts: 1,120
Threads: 57
Joined: Mar 2013
I think your gun example is more extreme. Even in Hawaii there are large tracts of private property. It would be very onerous for government to say that you can own a weapon but not fire it at these sites.
The marijuana situation is an evolving one. There is a big distinction between possessing something and selling it. IMO all guns sales should be licensed.
Posts: 4,248
Threads: 96
Joined: Mar 2014
quote:
Originally posted by MarkD
It is the size of the magazine for the AR-15 that makes all the difference. 30 round size, swapped easily. Much more fire power than a .45. This NY Times article is pretty informative.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/15/us/ar...-guns.html
story quote: "The carnage in Florida on Wednesday that left at least 17 dead seemed to confirm that the rifle and its variants have also become the weapons of choice for mass killers....The man accused of the killings in Parkland had “countless magazines” for his AR-15, the local sheriff said."
Hawaii already limits this to a 10 round maximum.
He had "countless" magazines but was only able to kill 17?
Something doesn't add up.
Posts: 3,203
Threads: 108
Joined: Jun 2010
I do not believe civil rights should have a fee attached, so I cannot back your proposal Rob. I do support personal responsibility for weapons though. How about this:
All weapons in Hawaii must be engraved with the name of the legal owner, and if that weapon is taken from an *unsecured* location (not in an anchored safe or lock box) or the theft not reported immediately the owner faces criminal charges. If someone is caught using a weapon without their name on it, without a signed note from (or presence of) the legal owner, criminal charges for both. Severe penalties. I'm a responsible owner, and those requirements would not be too onerous for me. They also wouldn't require any kind of database of gun owners.
Posts: 4,248
Threads: 96
Joined: Mar 2014
How about this:
All weapons in Hawaii must be engraved with the name of the legal owner, and if that weapon is taken from an *unsecured* location (not in an anchored safe or lock box) or the theft not reported immediately the owner faces criminal charges.
--------
How would you handle a sale?
