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Roundup (cancer causing substance) cases underway
And as I mentioned so many times before:

The chemical has been deemed safe and info released to public however, it should be noted the studies were by the companies own scientists- on the Monsanto payroll.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/opinion/open...ter-mobile

Corporate assurances of safety leave out one important word — a word that is critically important to anyone who wants to make an informed decision about the cancer risk associated with Roundup and the hundreds of other glyphosate-based herbicides on the market. That word is “independent,” as in “independent scientific studies and reviews.”

As was laid out in the trial, there is a wealth of evidence, much of it from within Monsanto’s own internal documents, detailing how much of the research suggesting that Roundup is safe has been orchestrated and/or influenced by Monsanto and its chemical industry allies.
But truly independent research has shown that there is reason for concern. As Roundup use on U.S. farms, residential lawns and gardens has soared from roughly 40 million pounds a year in the 1990s to nearly 300 million pounds in recent years, the dangers of the chemical have been documented in numerous peer-reviewed studies.

It was those independent and peer-reviewed works that convinced the cancer research arm of the World Health Organization to determine that glyphosate is a probable human carcinogen. In the wake of that WHO finding, California added glyphosate to the state’s list of cancer-causing chemicals.
Monsanto’s response to that 2015 classification was more manipulated science. An “independent review” of glyphosate showed up in a peer-reviewed scientific journal decrying the IARC classification. The review not only was titled as being independent, but declared that no Monsanto employee had any involvement in the writing of it.Yet the company’s internal emails, turned over in discovery associated with the litigation, revealed that a Monsanto scientist in fact aggressively edited and reviewed the analysis prior to its publication.

That was but one of multiple examples detailed in the unsealed documents of similar efforts, referred to by Monsanto’s own employees as “ghostwriting.”

The EPA has sided with Monsanto over independent scientists, declaring the pesticide is not likely to cause cancer. By doing so, the agency has ignored the fact that its own Office of Research and Development expressed unease with the EPA’s handling of the glyphosate evaluation, as did a scientific advisory panel convened by the agency to peer-review the evaluation.

Perhaps not surprisingly, the trial evidence also included communications detailing what can only be described as cozy collaborations between Monsanto and certain EPA officials.

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Hi EW,

Can you tell us any of the other items the WHO’s IARC classifies as probably carcinogenic to humans (Group 2A)?

Do you have any opinions on why the IARC evaluates possible carcinogens as hazards and not as risks? Further, how do you define or differentiate between hazards and risks?

Thanks!

Alohas
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Hey Jim. I see where you are going with this.

Here is the list:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IA...arcinogens

And maybe you can find your answer about hazards and risks here:
https://www.iarc.fr/en/media-centre/iarc...uation.pdf

My opinion: You used this example many times. Coffee, wine, lack of sleep and red meat are naturally occurring. Minus the insomnia, they contain nutrients.
Even though they may be in the same list or carcinogen risks, how can you compare them to Roundup?

A more accurate comparison would be with other like chemicals used in a comparable fashion and also made in a lab. For example: lets compare glyphosate, diazinon and malathion. See my point?

Go ahead and pour 3 cups of liquid. One coffee, one wine and one roundup. Given the option to drink one of them or pour the roundup on your body, which do people chose? It's a no-brainer.

Also: which of those choices is newer to mankind and hasn't been around long enough to evaluate?

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Given the option to drink one of them or pour the roundup on your body, which do people chose?

Shouldn’t the standard be - - when used as directed? Or as commonly used? For instance, would you put a few drops of super-hot hot sauce on your burrito? Would you drink a glass of it? Would you pour it in your eyes?

Roundup is not meant to be consumed or even applied to your skin. I think most people would agree if you drank a glass of it, there might be side effects. Just like if you drank a glass of hot sauce. Does that mean we ban hot sauce, or hope people use it properly? (Drinking a glass of the hottest hot sauce could kill you)

On Tuesday night, 9/18/2018 Hawaii Senator Mazie Hirono had another message for the Republican senators on the Judiciary Committee “Just shut up and step up. Do the right thing.” She added in another related comment, “Bull$hit.”
"I'm at that stage in life where I stay out of discussions. Even if you say 1+1=5, you're right - have fun." - Keanu Reeves
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Well, fwiw it’s the IARC making the comparisons not me - they list all those as group 2A (probably carcinogenic).

I’m still curious how you define hazards and risks though EW - I would be interested in hearing your description.

Also, what’s your take on why the IARC evaluates hazards and not risk?
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Roundup is not meant to be consumed or even applied to your skin.

Ahhh HOTPE

Well well, guess what. It's in your food now because of it's widespread use (unless you eat organic). Also if you're spraying it every day like that poor groundskeeper that contracted non-hodgkins lymphoma and sued the hell out of Monsanto, you will inevitably get it on your skin.

RainyJim you pose a couple of interesting questions, I'll have to think on that.
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well, guess what. It's in your food

Yes, in parts per billion if used as directed.
That’s quite different than pouring the concentrated liquid on yourself, with each molecule a billion times stronger than the properly diluted, mixed, sprayed, then biodegraded by the sun, rain, and number of days from application until harvest?
"I'm at that stage in life where I stay out of discussions. Even if you say 1+1=5, you're right - have fun." - Keanu Reeves
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EW: Go ahead and pour 3 cups of liquid. One coffee, one wine and one roundup. Given the option to drink one of them or pour the roundup on your body, which do people chose? It's a no-brainer.

Go ahead and pour 3 cups of liquid. One coffee, one wine, and one glyphosate. Add the contents to a 4 gallon backpack sprayer respectively. Spray the contents on the jangle of vegetation along a fence line until it runs out. Wait a couple weeks. Eat the remains of the vegetation and let us know how it goes, fecally.

I think you have invented a new category of logical fallacy with that thought experiment. I kinda like it and will use it whenever I can. I mean when I want to impress people around me with my advanced intellect so that I can save them from the evil inherent in pretending to turn a blind eye to the facts. I mean, so many of the people I want to impress need _me_ to guide them away from lies, lies, lies, and reveal the truth.

They’re just a bunch of dolts anyway. Same old stupid story.

I hope rainyjim and HotPE keep posting polite replies so you can keep coming up with this kind of logic. I do see where you’re going with this and it is entertaining in a pus-oozing wart sort of way. Just can’t take my eyes off it.

Cheers,
Kirt

Edit: typos usage

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Cheers Kurt.

And there's the condescending remarks I was referring to earlier.

I'm done here.
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I am still up here in Alaska. While I see here that people get frustrated with the argument I am happy to see that there is one. When the day finally comes and I am rocking gray hair wearing nothing but sandals and ragged cutoffs in my garden on 10 & C there will be no Roundup used there. All that chemical junk stinks like poison. It may work good but so did washing my hands with gasoline back in another era. I have somehow survived so far trying to filter all the bad in the world through this body. I wouldn't trust big industry for one reason: its existence is to make as much money as possible. The good it achieves really is good. Does that mean trust them?
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