Match, I agree with much of what you say but there were some stereotypical prejudiced in there. Welfare for single women with kids, victims of domestic abuse I have no problem paying taxes to support. It's about the only thing this county does I can support.
The trash? no doubt, tourists aren't dropping off refrigerators, But I have seen plenty film pack wrappers at say Rainbow Falls or many other trails all over the island. Locals aren't seeing the sights.
We have towed cars to the dumps that were not ours but weren't going to wait on the AV county program. As well as carcases, boats, sofas and 50 gal. drums that had who know what besides oil in them. But we done see it as any big volunteer deal, it's just right keeping the aina as long as we can the way it is.
As far as the cops giving tickets for littering? Never heard of it ever happening. They don't even follow through on burglaries or domestic violence. Unless it make the paper it probably won't even make it to the prosecutors office.
The laws are there, but there are the personnel on the island like Oahu has for hazardous waste and public health. Send a letter to the Health Dept. in Hilo and they'll forward it to Oahu anyway. Where it will die in bureaucracy.
I agree with loff that we don't need more tourists. We need more police and firefighters. So when the lava does cross the highway and starts a fire storm who's gonna put it out?
Besides the way the rip lots pin to pin it there are any rusty cars, bottles, frigs on the lot they'll just be buried with the forest that goes down with it. Worst dumpers I've seen were construction crews off loading building debris because they were to lazy to drive it to town.
Again loff hit's it on the head. This blogs seem like a pretty like minded group, in that they all "discuss" how Puna should be "developed". Half or more it seem aren't even taxpayers of the state or are partime residents. One year living here makes you a resident but to understand the culture that was here and that everyone came to enjoy seems to be going the way of all other exploited beautiful places on the planet.
I've lived in several resort places around the world and there are pluses and minuses everywhere. But I agree with the topic that the Aloha has been fading since the "boom". The amout of trash I see on the roads is about the same. Only with more and more people there will be more and more trash. More road rage, more people stuck in traffic.
Less aloha.
So recycle, rebuild, reuse, and THINK when you buy things what's the life expectancy of the product and where will you dispose of it?
You know how we get ripped off on shipping anything here from the mainland? Cause we ain't in the continental states. Free shipping to all states but Alaska, Hawaii and Puerto Rico.
Well here's a tip, ask them for a return ups sticker with your order in case you need to send it back. And take all the stupid catalogs they send all the way to Hawaii en mass, L.L. Bean etc.? Fill a box with them and all the styrofoam packaging materials they send, return them to sender rather than put them in our land fills. Send them some mac nut cookies and a thank you for charging you 9.95 shipping for an 5.89 item. They have bigger landfills on the mainland and I think the way stuff is over packaged is a major waste. Return to sender.
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quote:
Originally posted by loffelkopffl
as far as tourists, i disagree, we need less of them than more, don't they have enough resorts on maui&Oahu? let's keep the BI as rural as possible.
sorry to pop your balloon, but tourism is a necessary evil here in Hawaii. It is the state's main source of income. Without it where would Hawaii be?
As far as keeping Hawaii rural, them days are nearing to an end. Trying to keep infrastructure from the east-side will only contribute to the problem we already have with this mini population boom that is already in effect.
I'm simply amazed at how some of you think. We must all look at the greater picture, and just worry about ourselves and our own little world. Some of you have been here many year 5,10, and 20 years, and feel you have a God given right to decide the fate of newbies to Puna. Yet none of you really consider what the indiginous people think or want here for their Aina. Let's not forget, whether you are here 5,10 ,20 or more years and are considered a "Kaamaina", you are only a guest of this Aina and her people.
For those of you fairly new residents to the islands. It wasn't that long ago that that one could typically hear the phrase on a daily basis ," Haole, go home". Though things have mellowed in recent years somewhat. But that could all change in the near future. A lot of the indiginous people who support the Hawaii Nation movement also support the Idea of removing the evil white devils from the Aina......that also includes the yellow devil,brown devils too. I tell you truthfully, if you try to keep Puna rural, that is eventually what will happen here. The indiginous people here are tired of the morning commuter traffic, they want their "Big Box Stores",etc, etc.. So the more people try to suppress that, the more animosity the indiginous people feel towards the progressive haole who reside in Puna. Then the cycle starts all over again. For the fairly new arrivals to the island who think this is paradise, your in for a rude awakening!
Handle every situation like a dog,If you can't eat it or hump it,piss on it and walk away...
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quote:
Worst dumpers I've seen were construction crews off loading building debris because they were to lazy to drive it to town...
Specifics? I think this is a rural legend. Most of the time if that is happening - owners are doing it. Construction crews can rent the dumpsters for such little money compared to loading and driving the trash anywhere.
quote:
....So recycle, rebuild, reuse, and THINK when you buy things what's the life expectancy of the product and where will you dispose of it? ...
Well here's a tip, ask them for a return ups sticker with your order in case you need to send it back. And take all the stupid catalogs they send all the way to Hawaii en mass, L.L. Bean etc.? Fill a box with them and all the styrofoam packaging materials they send, return them to sender rather than put them in our land fills. Send them some mac nut cookies and a thank you for charging you 9.95 shipping for an 5.89 item. They have bigger landfills on the mainland and I think the way stuff is over packaged is a major waste. Return to sender.
Now there I heartily agree with you. I have tried and tried to get off even junk mailing lists. It is almost impossible to make it to zero.
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Pohaku,
On this forum local and state politics are worthy topics of discussion. I do not provide a forum for national or world politics.
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quote:
Originally posted by Rob Tucker
Pohaku,
On this forum local and state politics are worthy topics of discussion. I do not provide a forum for national or world politics.
Punaweb moderator
that's truly unfortunate Rob. Because National politics do effect us here probably more so than you wanna admit. Especially with the presidential election coming right around the corner.
Handle every situation like a dog,If you can't eat it or hump it,piss on it and walk away...
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Beachboy,
You are certainly able to discuss national politics, presidential elections and world issues in a thousand different places on the internet. I make no claim that these topics don't have any effect here.
I launched Punaweb so that Puna could have one small place to define itself and communicate on local issues. I lack time and resources to play hall monitor to all the arguments and acrimony that will follow mainland political issues.
If you truly believe another venue for discussing the upcoming presidential election is needed then do feel free to launch one.
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Rob
how are not national and world politic relevant to puna?
I think exactly what we need is some federal support as the local county and state agencies aren't effective in stopping the increasing crime, trashing of the aina or regulating the destruction of america's only rain forest.
I think out police department needs a federal investigation into it's capacity to do their job. The assessment will be scary, but maybe, just maybe they'll get computers on board. They don't even have a local fingerprint database they can compare finger prints for burglary scenes. Just heard of another yesterday down on 5th in HPP, they went straight for the guns. It's gonna escalate as they get more and more newcomers arms.
I think NOW is long over due for some National intervention. No child left behind? a JOKE, Keaau-Pahoa rated among the lowest in the country. Local DOE is one autonomous body. Not like mainland districts where local problems are adjusted to each schools needs. I think it would take something federal to break up that monolopy.
World politics? Hello, this is going out on the world wide web, ya think people other than mainlanders are reading this an anticipating a move?
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You are making my point for me. Thanks.
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I'm glad that Pohaku and others are giving a counterpoint on this.
I myself, like everyone else posting about this, don't litter or dump ...
but that is MY and OUR cultural background. Yes, it is a small planet so we can support our point of view with lots of "right" and "shoulds" BUT as malihini we need to be very aware when we are imposing our own beliefs and background on the people who were here first.
The idea that people came here to experience nature in all its beauty is simply not true of the earlier group migrations to this island. People came for business, opportunity, as indentured workers, for agriculture, for industry, and of course the missionaries came to spread their concept of right and civilization.
Do you think the sugar cane camps centered on mill life were concerned with preserving the `aina? Instead, in a climate where rust never sleeps and the jungle grows quick, without disposal for large items, things went into gulches and got pushed into corners ... I have a dead car on my land I didn't even know was here until after escrow closed; it is covered in vines ... (and I am on Hamakua; it's not a Puna specific practice).
Next door to me, the house and yard are full of what I would call junk, and lots of yards around here are like that. Guess what, my neighbors feel COMFORTABLE with their environment and my neat little enclave I'm sure doesn't seem like a good thing, but rather a foreign look to the neighborhood.
Yes, it made me mad when we lived in Hilo to have kids throw beer bottles out of the car at our rock walls and to have to pick up fast food wrappings, sure. I hope the education kicks in for the upcoming generation, because it sure didn't take with the current youth, at least not all of them. But it isn't going to stop overnight, and I really see no point in ranting about other people or patting ourselves on the back. Just try to have good habits ...
Glen, lol about the Swiss. OK, I've been to Switzerland and stayed with Swiss hosts for extended non-vacation purposes, and hands down they are the most anal-retentive people I've ever encountered. Yes, they keep things beautiful, but there's a price to pay of living around people who make so many rules and are constantly enforcing them on others ... no one dares to step outside the box. (I remember riding on the train there, enjoying the fresh air in MY seat, when a Swiss man got up, leaned over me, shut my window and informed me "we will have the windows closed here." Um, OK, that is not my idea of utopia being around people who believe that they and only they know what is right.
I went to Japan and was shocked to see the public trash cans overflowing on the streets of Kyoto in front of national treasures. Different culture, different standards. This neatness that we think is RIGHT and BEST comes from European backgrounds, (The official language in Singapore is English). Many people here hail from rural Asian cultures. Native Hawaiian practices are honored by a small percentage of the people. If you visit other Polynesian-settled islands, you will see the same attitude about junk and trash as here though.
By the way, I'm old enough to remember a California that had bottles, cans and trash along all the roadsides. I used to count on finding a dollar's worth of deposit Coke bottles when I walked a block or two (back in the early 60's). Ladybird Johnson's campaign to Keep America Beautiful had a huge impact on our culture. I know I saw the changes take place between the early 60's and the end of the decade. Americans, unlike Europeans who have been living on the same small pieces of land for over a milennium, were not so kind to the new land they spread out on. We too had to learn.
Sorry, don't mean to rant, but let's remember people have different ways and other cultural norms than us, and let's not feel superior because we grew up with a different set of values. As Pohaku said, don't assume you are admired for your values ... especially when you come in and try to make sweeping changes.
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KathyH... great insight and so true
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