Jones act hurting Puerto Rico?

[kalakoa]

Hard to prepare for the crisis of having all your roads impassible and total loss of power.

So, only a little worse than daily life in Puna?

[Eric1600]

Originally posted by kalakoa

"Hard to prepare for the crisis of having all your roads impassible and total loss of power."
So, only a little worse than daily life in Puna?


Imagine not only are the roads impassible but all the families of the first responders are living in rubble, scavenging for shelter, food and water. No, they're not rushing out to repair your downed lines or help clear roads, haul supplies around the island, etc. And the devastation is everywhere, not just a section of Puna and not with just 50,000 people, but millions.

Then to top it off the president declares he's going to wipe out your debt and tanks the state's bond market. Then you'd be close to having a Puerto Rican day.

[Frank]

"either ignorant or just stupid"


some light on this subject...

https://www.bloomberg.com/quicktake/puerto-ricos-slide

[geochem]

quote:

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Originally posted by Eric1600

Hard to prepare for the crisis of having all your roads impassible and total loss of power. I'm not sure what people expect to happen on an island 110 miles by 40 miles with 3.5 million people. There's only so much pulling of you own bootstraps when your shoes are underwater. It's either ignorant or just stupid to think they will be able to handle it on their own.

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No one is saying that PR should have to manage on their own - but, as is the case for Hawaii, recognizing that, living on an island, you are extremely vulnerable and that you are subject to the effects of severe natural hazards. A good place to start in protecting your citizens is to aggressively push an agenda of self-reliance for for your residents as Hawaii's Emergency Management Agency does. Do you have food and water reserves that can sustain you and your family for two weeks in the event of a major hazard event? If not, why not?

[Kapoho Joe]

2 weeks was not enough for some during Iselle, imagine if an actual major class hurricane were to hit Puna. Maybe we should be planning for a whole month instead!

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

some light on this subject...

Frank,
I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying that FEMA should not provide food and water for the 3+ million people in Puerto Rico who had no personal involvement whatsoever in creating the territory's debt? If you, living in Hawaii, regularly paid all of your bills but the state or county of Hawaii was in a debt crisis, should you be ineligible for emergency assistance because of guilt by association?

What about the people in charge of appropriating funds? Should we also hold them to a higher standard, have them prove their ability to manage their own money without resorting to bankruptcy after bankruptcy, and manipulating the tax code for decades so they could stay afloat only by not paying taxes? That doesn't sound like someone who can be counted on to make the right decision under normal circumstances, much less in times of crisis.

The Donner Party really wasn't that great of a party, was it?

[Eric1600]

No one is saying that PR should have to manage on their own...

People are making a lot of excuses rather than dealing with the difficult situation: "FEMA isn't a first responder." "Puerto Rico wants everything done for them." “……#FakeNews critics are working overtime, but we’re getting great marks from the people that truly matter! #PRStrong”

FEMA hasn't even authorized full disaster help for Puerto Rico as of yesterday. Two weeks after Hurricane Maria tore through Puerto Rico, the situation on the island remains dire: Only 5 percent of the electrical grid has been repaired, only 17 percent of cellphone towers are working, and more than half of residents don't have running water.

But the Federal Emergency Management Agency has not authorized every disaster response tool it has at its disposal — including aid for more permanent repairs on the island's roads, bridges, water control facilities, public utilities, and government buildings. FEMA authorized this level of aid for Texas 10 days after Hurricane Harvey flooded the Houston area with 4.5 feet of rain.

The government of Puerto Rico already asked for this kind of aid: Under FEMA rules, the governor of the affected state is supposed to put in a formal request for this kind of extra help. A spokesperson for FEMA in Puerto Rico that the commonwealth just submitted the paperwork Tuesday morning, but didn't say how soon the aid might be authorized.

A good place to start in protecting your citizens is to aggressively push an agenda of self-reliance for for your residents as Hawaii's Emergency Management Agency does.

Do you have a flood and wind proof storage system? Non-electrical water purifier? There is really only so much you can reasonably expect 3.4 million people to do. Perhaps in PUNA we can all start prepping but it's different if there's millions of people. Here's Hawaii's/FEMA's official response plan: http://dod.hawaii.gov/hiema/sert-resourc...resources/

And here's what people are recommended to do: https://dod.hawaii.gov/hiema/files/2017/...ess-NR.pdf

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

aggressively push an agenda of self-reliance for for your residents

Think about what happens when a hurricane warning in Hawaii is issued: shelves of water, rice, bread, flashlights, batteries, etc. empty out, all the essentials such as 4x8 sheets of plywood and screws at Home Depot sell out.

The only reason the impact of Iselle was limited, was that we could drive to Hilo within a day or two for supplies, and since the people in Hilo were unaffected by the storm we didn't have to compete with them for limited resources. Otherwise, by the time we in Puna arrived in Hilo, residents there would have already snapped up the essentials and emptied the tanks at the gas stations, leaving some Puna residents unable to buy even $5 worth of gas needed for the drive home.

Remember, after Iselle we couldn't even buy a bag of ice to keep food already in our refrigerators cold. Does that sound like we're any better prepared for a Maria size event than people in Puerto Rico?

The Donner Party really wasn't that great of a party, was it?

[kalakoa]

Non-electrical water purifier?

Propane-fired, perhaps?

Remember, after Iselle we couldn't even buy a bag of ice to keep food already in our refrigerators cold.

Exactly my point. We live at the tail end of a long supply chain with between 3 and 10 days of margin (depending who you ask and how they're measuring it). Ige set a goal to double local food production, but that's useless without distribution.

Closer to home: many people live on "privately owned" roads which have serious flooding issues. In some cases there is no alternate route out of the subdivision. County maintains that this is "not their problem" while raising the FTR because "road maintenance" and increasing (some) property tax because "budget shortfall".

The HART guideway won't flood, maybe after the next Big Emergency we can turn it into miles of "refugee camp"? Assuming we can get to Oahu, of course.

[Frank]

quote:

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Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge

some light on this subject...

Frank,
"I'm not sure what your point is."

My point is to alleviate some of that "either ignorant or just stupid" notion by providing a creditable link to pertinent information.


"Are you saying that FEMA should not provide food and water for the 3+ million people in Puerto Rico who had no personal involvement whatsoever in creating the territory's debt?"

No

If you, living in Hawaii, regularly paid all of your bills but the state or county of Hawaii was in a debt crisis, should you be ineligible for emergency assistance because of guilt by association?

No (missed ineligible on the first go...edit out yes)

"What about the people in charge of appropriating funds? Should we also hold them to a higher standard, have them prove their ability to manage their own money without resorting to bankruptcy after bankruptcy, and manipulating the tax code for decades so they could stay afloat only by not paying taxes?"

Yes

"That doesn't sound like someone who can be counted on to make the right decision under normal circumstances, much less in times of crisis."

Your right

The Donner Party really wasn't that great of a party, was it?

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No, it wasn't