economic impact of TMT "controversy"

[Guest]

The economic impact is only one of the many impacts the TMT project promises to bring our island.

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/20...nment.html

[opihikao]

Well, at this point, the least of my worries are the "economic impact of TMT controversy" given the elevated "status" of Mauna Loa.

Good God, Akua, and all that whomever you pray to, the threat of Mauna Loa erupting (versus the TMT debacle) supercedes this concern as to our economy.

Some may want to "clean their house" within the next few days/months/years for that "special visitor". We call her Tutu Pele.

No matter what, all Hawai'i stand together (ALL of us). Hawai'i Aloha.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_17vGYa81s


Enjoy yourselves, in your special piece of "paradise", no matter the economic challenges, as we (our ohana) do. Those of us who work a lifetime to preserve what is ours by birthright (our land), refuse to worship "dead Presidents on paper". A'ole.

Economic impact of TMT "controversy"? Please. We have seen many of these purported controversies. We are still here. []


JMO.

[Aaron S]

quote:

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Originally posted by opihikao
Good God, Akua, and all that whomever you pray to, the threat of Mauna Loa erupting (versus the TMT debacle) supercedes this concern as to our economy.

Those of us who work a lifetime to preserve what is ours by birthright (our land), refuse to worship "dead Presidents on paper".

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I've lived in Kailua-Kona 39 years, born and raised. Mauna Loa has had several of these episodes of enhanced activity since 1984. I'm not going to worry about it unless the earthquake activity increases. You have to live life to the fullest. If you start worrying about "what ifs", its certainly not healthy and waste of emotional energy.

By the way, your true colors are exposed by what you stated here "refuse to worship "dead Presidents on paper.", Those dead presidents allow me to survive here. I can't solely live off the ocean or eating coconuts all day long. I have bills to pay, food to buy, or other essentials for life. These can't be bought without those "dead Presidents" (your words, not mine).

I don't intend to live off government assistance unlike some people. This is why I follow this island's economic health, as it affects everyone living here.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

"dead Presidents on paper"

A few interesting facts about money, investments, "economic impact", and the Bishop Estate.

Investments and land rental fees from the Bishop Estate have been managed and reinvested to create one of the largest trusts in the nation, valued at $10 Billion. Some of these funds have been used to operate Kamehameha Schools, which has educated Hawaiian keiki and preserved Hawaiian culture through courses in language, hula, and the arts since 1887.

At her death, Bernice Pauahi Bishop's estate was the largest private landownership in the Kingdom of the Hawaiian Islands, comprising approximately 9% of Hawaii's total area. Pauahi was married to businessman and philanthropist Charles Reed Bishop.

Prince Lot Kapuaiwa became King Kamehameha V in 1863, and offered Pauahi the throne on his deathbed in 1872. But, taken aback, she replied, "No, no, not me; don't think of me. I don't need it."

After Bernice Pauahi Bishop's death in 1884, her husband Charles Reed Bishop started work in carrying out her will.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernice_Pauahi_Bishop

[MarkP]

The economic fall-out from the TMT debacle will be huge. Anyone who dismisses it or trivializes it is in deep denial.

ETA: Debacle is too negative (dictionary says complete failure). It still might turn into something constructive but only if the thing gets built. If not, that would be a shocking disaster. Protesting the superferry is one thing. It was a purely commercial venture and after all it is not out of the realm of possibility that they could hit a whale. For the state to be swayed by the nonsensical arguments against the TMT so far would be like a bank accepting a $3 bill. Goodbye credibility.

[dakine]

Mauna Loa has had several of these episodes of enhanced activity since 1984. I'm not going to worry about it unless the earthquake activity increases. You have to live life to the fullest. If you start worrying about "what ifs", its certainly not healthy and waste of emotional energy.

Not to say "worry" is the right approach, but I suspect having too casual of an attitude isn't either. I would not be lulled into thinking that the USGS will always be able to provide extended warnings. Mauna Loa's history is incredible, and even the 1984 eruption took the scientists at HVO by surprise. Sheesh when the eruption started they had no idea it was imminent, and in fact were all at a party and most of them well into their umpteenth drink when they realized it had.

Statistically Mauna Loa is a giant. HVO writes of the 1950 eruption, which if it were to occur today would destroy 100's of homes if not trap and possibly harm their inhabitants, in part as such:

The 1950 eruption lasted for 23 days. In that time it erupted 376 million cubic meters of lava, the largest outpouring of lava from the southwest rift zone of Mauna Loa since written records have been kept. This is equivalent to about 3.5-4 year's output for the ongoing Pu`u `O`o-Kupaianaha eruption of Kilauea. This comparison illustrates how much larger eruptions of Mauna Loa can be compared with those of Kilauea.

Flows from this eruption made their way to the sea in a hurry. For example, the Honokua flow covered the 24-km (15-mile) journey, from vent to the ocean, in less than 3 hours. When an eruption ensues along the southwest rift zone of Mauna Loa, things can happen quickly.

More can be read about the 1950 eruption here:

http://hvo.wr.usgs.gov/maunaloa/history/50_06_01/

Sorry 'bout the off topic detour. Yeah the TMT debacle has financial consequence, but OMG a Mauna Loa eruption, especially from the Southwest Rift will make it seem like chump change. Then we'll really see how screwed up our county/state land use policies are!

Carry on.

[PunaMauka2]

quote:

---

Originally posted by opihikao

Well, at this point, the least of my worries are the "economic impact of TMT controversy" given the elevated "status" of Mauna Loa.

Good God, Akua, and all that whomever you pray to, the threat of Mauna Loa erupting (versus the TMT debacle) supercedes this concern as to our economy.

Some may want to "clean their house" within the next few days/months/years for that "special visitor". We call her Tutu Pele.

No matter what, all Hawai'i stand together (ALL of us). Hawai'i Aloha.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_17vGYa81s


Enjoy yourselves, in your special piece of "paradise", no matter the economic challenges, as we (our ohana) do. Those of us who work a lifetime to preserve what is ours by birthright (our land), refuse to worship "dead Presidents on paper". A'ole.

Economic impact of TMT "controversy"? Please. We have seen many of these purported controversies. We are still here. []


JMO.

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Oy.


It's time once again for, Name That Fallacy...


quote: "Well, at this point, the least of my worries are the "economic impact of TMT controversy" given the elevated "status" of Mauna Loa.

Good God, Akua, and all that whomever you pray to, the threat of Mauna Loa erupting (versus the TMT debacle) supercedes this concern as to our economy."



a) Red Herring - http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index...ed-herring

b) Faulty Comparison - http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index...comparison

c) Avoiding the Issue - http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index...-the-issue

d) False Dilemma - http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index...se-dilemma

[punaticbychoice]

Dakine:
Railway saboteur.
Masterful but obvious topic derailment.
I am always concerned with volcanic and possible volcanic activity and consequences.
But let's stick with the MK goings on and the impact that will have. We can control that,
but not ML.

[PaulW]

One day we'll all look back at this and laugh. Imagine those fools, protesting against a telescope!

[EightFingers]

quote:

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Originally posted by kalakoa

Do you think the protesters care about economics?

They should; any benefits they receive are funded by the economy at large.

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Thank you![]