Access to Mauna Kea

[randomq]

Yeah, the irony here is that many of us Punatics are all for free speech, civil disobedience, and even breaking the law when it does not violate our neighbors rights. But people practicing civil disobedience should expect to be arrested, and blocking the road is most definitely violating others rights. The protesters are putting their religious or personal views ahead of everyone elses rights, and that's not how this country works.

[snorkle]

Indigenous cultures have been marginalized for centuries by colonial powers. Stripped of dignity, resources, and language.

Is this intimidating?

[ironyak]

I seem to remember that history lesson snarkle, when astronomers invaded the islands, stole the land, and banned the native languages. Or at least it was someone that looked like some of them - pictures were all in black of white, so should fit in with your view of things.

Maybe TomK can pay a toll to make up for all of Captain Cook's transgressions - those Brits are all alike, bloody w@nker colonists.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

Stripped of dignity, resources, and language.

1) Any recent dignity stripping you can cite as an example? DHHL doesn't count.
2) Resources - do you mean like property lease income, or a percentage of the proceeds from geothermal?
3) Language - like when astronomers named recent major discoveries, 'Oumuamua, Powehi, Laniakea, numerous asteroids and other distant solar system objects that would not have been discovered without the telescopes on Mauna Kea?

[snorkle]

"Manifest Destiny" was the social theory in the USA which claimed that the USA and its white, Christian citizens were chosen by God. Because of this "choosing" they were entitled to any land they pleased, despite who already owned it (not limited to Native Americans; also including other countries), with the purpose being that they spread their religion of Christianity and their concept of "civilization" to the other, "inferior", people of the world."

You can say that manifest destiny (or slavery for that matter) doesn't exist anymore; but I believe that the effects of it linger on today. Argue all you want about how indigenous and other minorities have the same advantages as white Christians, but statistics indicate otherwise.....The playing field has leveled somewhat, but is still uphill for many.....A lot of our troubles today seemingly stem from Caucasians insecure about becoming a minority; Why? Are minorities treated badly? Are they accused of being poor? uneducated? slovenly? anti-science? superstitious?.... Do they live in squander? Abandoned vehicles in their yards?

You guys will all deny any racist thoughts, yet regularly utter opinions, generalizations, and stereotypical attitudes that say otherwise.

How spectacularly unfair development has been here for you here; Traffic jams, government inefficiency and corruption. Then to top it all off, the local "savages" are blocking roads. You act like they should be sorry to inconvenience poor you, but ignore any of the roadblocks minorities have endured for centuries.

Ku Kia'i Mauna !

The movement's only getting stronger.

[MattKarma]

quote:

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Originally posted by snorkle

Indigenous cultures have been marginalized for centuries by colonial powers. Stripped of dignity, resources, and language.

Is this intimidating?

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For *millenia*, aeons, to put this in perspective. Some survive, flourish ... and even eventually become the new oppressors.

***Still can't figure out how to spell 'car' correctly***

[kalakoa]

Astronomers have been sidelined for weeks by Kingdom powers. Stripped of dignity, resources, and discoveries....

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

"Manifest Destiny" was the social theory in the USA
In Hawaii I believe it was called "uniting the islands."

slavery for that matter
Subjects of the monarchy were required to cut and haul Sandalwood for free. Might that be considered slavery?
Subjects in an earlier era worked in the adze quarries, away from their families for months at a time. I don't believe the high wages were ever memorialized in oral traditions, but a reasonable estimate might put it on par with the Sandalwood industry.

local "savages" are blocking roads
Today the County gives them barricades and a free stoplight. If a similar protest took place on the King's Highway a few hundred years ago, would the law enforcement arm of the monarchy, acting as judge, jury, and executioner resolve the protestor's concerns in seconds, or minutes?

roadblocks minorities have endured for centuries.
Quickly settled and removed. See King's Highway example above.

[snorkle]

quote:

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Originally posted by HereOnThePrimalEdge

"Manifest Destiny" was the social theory in the USA
In Hawaii I believe it was called "uniting the islands."

You could argue that happened as a result of Western influence; with Western weapon technology. Not necessarily a good thing.

slavery for that matter
Subjects of the monarchy were required to cut and haul Sandalwood for free. Might that be considered slavery?

No, because "subjects" had the freedom to leave their Ahupua'a for another if they felt their ruler was being unfair. Remember; indigenous cultures tended to put the "village" ahead of the individual.

Subjects in an earlier era worked in the adze quarries, away from their families for months at a time. I don't believe the high wages were ever memorialized in oral traditions, but a reasonable estimate might put it on par with the Sandalwood industry.

Same response.

local "savages" are blocking roads
Today the County gives them barricades and a free stoplight. If a similar protest took place on the King's Highway a few hundred years ago, would the law enforcement arm of the monarchy, acting as judge, jury, and executioner resolve the protestor's concerns in seconds, or minutes?

Same response.

roadblocks minorities have endured for centuries.
Quickly settled and removed. See King's Highway example above.

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The "white minority" here actually have the same freedoms; as your "leader" says: "If you don't like it here, you can go back to where you came from". Indigenous peoples don't have that luxury.

[leilanidude]

Weren't the adze quarries on Mauna Kea, desecration?

What do you call King Kam's takeover and slaughter of Hawaiians located on other islands? Was there a legal treaty of annexation?