September 11th

[haoleboy]

Seems like we have an aloha shortage again! Since I've sill got more than I can use, I'll pass some on to you truthseekers who are educating themselves. Enjoy the following, and remember, if it's on the internet, it must be true! http://www.elchupacabra.com/ http://www.ufos-aliens.co.uk/cosmicapollo.html http://www.bfro.net/

Aloha
Richwhiteboy

"Milk is for babies. When you grow up, you have to drink beer."- Arnold Schwarzenegger

Edited by - haoleboy on 09/12/2006 17:23:43

[JensOrganics]

You're quoting that retard Gropenator now? LOL!

The son of an SS nazi officer, Schwarzenegger has publicly stated that he has dreamed of being a dictator and that he admires Hitler. He campaigned for war criminal Kurt Waldhiem after it had been made public that he was a top nazi!

Here's some more quotes from Arnold for you:

'Here's how it works. Money comes in, favors go out, the people lose.'

'My relationship to power and authority is that I'm all for it'

'People need somebody to watch over them... Ninety-five percent of the people in the world need to be told what to do and how to behave.'

'My friends don't want me to mention Kurt's name, because of all the recent Nazi stuff and the U.N. controversy, but I love him and Maria does too, and so thank you, Kurt.'
Arnold Schwarzenegger on his friend and fellow Austrian Kurt Waldheim, a Nazi war criminal.

'I was born to be a leader. I love the fact that millions of people look up to me.'

http://www.arnoldexposed.com/

You believe the Bush administration with absolutely NO evidence whatsoever, strictly based on their word. That's why we're in the Iraq fiasco today with another 2600 Americans dead and over 100,000 innocent Iraqi women, children and 80 year old goat herders killed! I've shown you lots of evidence. Where's your evidence you base your opinion on?

Did you know that many of the hijackers have been seen alive today? There are no arabs on the flight manifests or autopsy reports. Here's a BBC report:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_...559151.stm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgkkeTZWZuU

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=9%2F11+hijackers+still+alive&btnG=Google+Search

We're supposed to believe that a 757 vaporized at the Pentagon leaving not a trace of evidence yet the flesh of the passengers survived to be fingerprinted! GIVE ME A BREAK! Funny there are FEMA photos of a single 2 foot wide rotor from an A3 Skywarrior in the Pentagon but no evidence of the 9 foot wide titanium and steel engines from a 757! We are also supposed to believe that this 757 punched a hole through 9 feet of steel-reinforced concrete of 3 rings and left nothing on the other side of the hole!

http://members.shaw.ca/freedomsix/pics/p...nchout.gif

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2VoUN-7RVU

Since you like nazis I'll quote another one for you - 'The bigger the lie, the more people will believe it' - Adolf Hitler

http://www.bushflash.com/14.html

Edited by - JensOrganics on 09/13/2006 07:03:36

[mella l]

Sent an email to JensOrganics and the email was returned! Wrong email address? How does that work?? Interesting.


"The following message to <jensorganics@hawaii.rr.com> was undeliverable.
The reason for the problem:
5.1.0 - Unknown address error 550-'5.1.1 unknown or illegal alias: jensorganics@hawaii.rr.com' "



mella l

Edited by - mella l on 09/13/2006 09:20:56

[tada]

Sounds like we better get some guns before Big Brother repeals the 2nd Amendment.

Others want to make friends- I just want to make money.
James Cramer

[JensOrganics]

I recently moved from Maui to Puna, that was my old address I used to register.

Edited by - jensorganics on 09/14/2006 12:47:52

[haoleboy]

Seems my aloha infusion didn't take. Some people you just can't reach.

Aloha to everyone else!
Richwhiteboy

"White people scare the crap out of me."- Michael Moore

[mella l]

I have know about the Loose Change video for some time. A young college friend told me about it quite some time ago. Well until this thread I really hadn't bothered to check into it.

After viewing the video and reading other articles, I have three questions.

1. How could the regime (I hate this word THEY love to use, it seems to fit here) that is in charge of the debacle in the mid east, that has demolished all good will to our nation, coordinate the hoax of all time. Impossible.

2. Of all the putts bought on the market just days before 9-11, who bought these putts, what corporations, individuals profited from these inflated and documented purchases on the stock exchange? Follow the money.

3. Of everyone necessary and involved including those who supposedly disappeared from airplanes why no whistleblowers?

So here are are just a few of the things I read (thanks to my level headed, skeptic of a skeptic love), that I found interesting.

May 23, 2005
FAHRENHEIT 2777
By Michael Shermer 9/11 has generated the mother of all conspiracy theories how steel works
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?SID=mail&articleID=000DA0E2-1E15-128A-9E1583414B7F0000&chanID=sa006
© 1996-2006 Scientific American
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loose_Change_(video)

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1227842.html?page=2&c=y

http://911research.wtc7.net/reviews/loos...index.html

http://internetdetectives.biz/case/loose-change

http://www.salon.com/ent/feature/2006/06...ex_np.html

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/green...hange.html

9/11 paranoia breeds nutball conspiracy talesThe Democratic nominee in Florida's 15th congressional district maintains a website outlining positions on abortion, border security, gay marriage and beach re nourishment (''We must do it smarter'') that wouldn't strike anyone as political paranoia.
The full article will be available on the Web for a limited time:
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/new...475625.htm


So those are interesting articles, and I'm sure there are others. At some point after reading and weighing information we each must form an opinion we are comfortable with. I choose to believe this is interesting, and will go with what little faith I have left that this conspiracy is interesting and may have some truth in it, but we will never know all the truth and must have a little faith to even get up tomorrow morning.

That others want to stuff their RUDEwb points down our throats, stifle any discussion or understanding, why because they are so smart or know so much more than we could possible understand, or are so well connected they KNOW best, is so offensive to me I bolt.

If these sites don't come thru let me know if you are interested I can email them to you.

Real Aloha begins at home, from the heart and radiates all light possible. Mella




mella l

[JensOrganics]

At the very least you have to admit there are many, many unanswered questions. A real independent investigation needs to happen. Why did the White House want to block an investigation? This country spent $600,000 investigating the world trade center, but we spent $40 MILLION investigating Clinton's blow job. Are you comfortable with that?

It could take me hours to explain more, if people want to know more it's very easy to research. There are over 50 million pages available regarding 9/11 truth.

The 9/11 commission concluded that they have no idea why WTC 7 collapsed, the 3rd in one day when no steel building has ever collapsed due to fire in world history. Yet WTC leaseholder Larry Silverstein (became leaseholder in July 2001!) said himself on PBS that he asked the fire department to 'pull' it. A term used in controlled demolition to bring down a building (which takes weeks to set up).

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7750532340306101329&q=Larry+Silverstein+pull+it

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5992010660320459670&q=Larry+Silverstein+pull+it

Prior to the election in 2000, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and other Bush admininstration members were a part of a right wing think tank called The Project For The New American Century. They realized their doctrine would be impossible to pull off without a 'New Pearl Harbor' Sept. 2000. What happened one year later?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6638713703231012207&q=New+Pearl+Harbor

Did you know that W's first business was called Arbusto Energy and his business partner was Osama Bin Laden's brother Salem Bin Laden! This brother later died in a small plane crash in TEXAS.
The Bin Ladens and Bush's have been in business together for years via Bush 41's Carlisle Group. Bin Laden Construction built the US military bases in Saudi Arabia. In fact Bin Laden was a CIA asset during Afganistan's war with the Soviet Union.

Many whisleblowers have come forward, most have been threatened to shut up. Sen Paul Wellstone wanted a larger investigation into 9/11 then at that same time he died in a suspicious small plane crash.

http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/bush_insider.html

http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/on...sider.html

To believe the 'official conspiracy theory' you have to also believe in 'coincidence theories':

http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/20...o-911.html

[loffelkopffl]

one thing that is for sure is that the warmonger bush and his supporters are about as anti aloha as you could ever get, and that's a fact jack! IMHO

[JensOrganics]

The Coincidence Theorist's Guide to 9/11

That governments have permitted terrorist acts against their own people, and have even themselves been perpetrators in order to find strategic advantage is quite likely true, but this is the United States we're talking about.

That intelligence agencies, financiers, terrorists and narco-criminals have a long history together is well established, but the Nugan Hand Bank, BCCI, Banco Ambrosiano, the P2 Lodge, the CIA/Mafia anti-Castro/Kennedy alliance, Iran/Contra and the rest were a long time ago, so there’s no need to rehash all that. That was then, this is now!

That Jonathan Bush’s Riggs Bank has been found guilty of laundering terrorist funds and fined a US-record $25 million must embarrass his nephew George, but it's still no justification for leaping to paranoid conclusions.

That George Bush's brother Marvin sat on the board of the Kuwaiti-owned company which provided electronic security to the World Trade Centre, Dulles Airport and United Airlines means nothing more than you must admit those Bush boys have done alright for themselves.

That George Bush found success as a businessman only after the investment of Osama’s brother Salem and reputed al Qaeda financier Khalid bin Mahfouz is just one of those things - one of those crazy things.

That Osama bin Laden is known to have been an asset of US foreign policy in no way implies he still is.

That al Qaeda was active in the Balkan conflict, fighting on the same side as the US as recently as 1999, while the US protected its cells, is merely one of history's little aberrations.

The claims of Michael Springman, State Department veteran of the Jeddah visa bureau, that the CIA ran the office and issued visas to al Qaeda members so they could receive training in the United States, sound like the sour grapes of someone who was fired for making such wild accusations.

That one of George Bush's first acts as President, in January 2001, was to end the two-year deployment of attack submarines which were positioned within striking distance of al Qaeda's Afghanistan camps, even as the group's guilt for the Cole bombing was established, proves that a transition from one administration to the next is never an easy task.

That so many influential figures in and close to the Bush White House had expressed, just a year before the attacks, the need for a "new Pearl Harbor" before their militarist ambitions could be fulfilled, demonstrates nothing more than the accidental virtue of being in the right place at the right time.

That the company PTECH, founded by a Saudi financier placed on America’s Terrorist Watch List in October 2001, had access to the FAA’s entire computer system for two years before the 9/11 attack, means he must not have been such a threat after all.

That whistleblower Indira Singh was told to keep her mouth shut and forget what she learned when she took her concerns about PTECH to her employers and federal authorities, suggests she lacked the big picture. And that the Chief Auditor for JP Morgan Chase told Singh repeatedly, as she answered questions about who supplied her with what information, that "that person should be killed," suggests he should take an anger management seminar.

That on May 8, 2001, Dick Cheney took upon himself the job of co-ordinating a response to domestic terror attacks even as he was crafting the administration’s energy policy which bore implications for America's military, circumventing the established infrastructure and ignoring the recommendations of the Hart-Rudman report, merely shows the VP to be someone who finds it hard to delegate.

That the standing order which covered the shooting down of hijacked aircraft was altered on June 1, 2001, taking discretion away from field commanders and placing it solely in the hands of the Secretary of Defense, is simply poor planning and unfortunate timing. Fortunately the error has been corrected, as the order was rescinded shortly after 9/11.

That in the weeks before 9/11, FBI agent Colleen Rowley found her investigation of Zacarias Moussaoui so perversely thwarted that her colleagues joked that bin Laden had a mole at the FBI, proves the stress-relieving virtue of humour in the workplace.

That Dave Frasca of the FBI’s Radical Fundamentalist Unit received a promotion after quashing multiple, urgent requests for investigations into al Qaeda assets training at flight schools in the summer of 2001 does appear on the surface odd, but undoubtedly there's a good reason for it, quite possibly classified.

That FBI informant Randy Glass, working an undercover sting, was told by Pakistani intelligence operatives that the World Trade Center towers were coming down, and that his repeated warnings which continued until weeks before the attacks, including the mention of planes used as weapons, were ignored by federal authorities, is simply one of the many "What Ifs" of that tragic day.

That over the summer of 2001 Washington received many urgent, senior-level warnings from foreign intelligence agencies and governments - including those of Germany, France, Great Britain, Russia, Egypt, Israel, Morocco, Afghanistan and others - of impending terror attacks using hijacked aircraft and did nothing, demonstrates the pressing need for a new Intelligence Czar.

That John Ashcroft stopped flying commercial aircraft in July 2001 on account of security considerations had nothing to do with warnings regarding September 11, because he said so to the 9/11 Commission.

That former lead counsel for the House David Schippers says he’d taken to John Ashcroft’s office specific warnings he’d learned from FBI agents in New York of an impending attack – even naming the proposed dates, names of the hijackers and the targets – and that the investigations had been stymied and the agents threatened, proves nothing but David Schipper’s pathetic need for attention.

That Garth Nicolson received two warnings from contacts in the intelligence community and one from a North African head of state, which included specific site, date and source of the attacks, and passed the information to the Defense Department and the National Security Council to evidently no effect, clearly amounts to nothing, since virtually nobody has ever heard of him.

That in the months prior to September 11, self-described US intelligence operative Delmart Vreeland sought, from a Toronto jail cell, to get US and Canadian authorities to heed his warning of his accidental discovery of impending catastrophic attacks is worthless, since Vreeland was a dubious character, notwithstanding the fact that many of his claims have since been proven true.

That FBI Special Investigator Robert Wright claims that agents assigned to intelligence operations actually protect terrorists from investigation and prosecution, that the FBI shut down his probe into terrorist training camps, and that he was removed from a money-laundering case that had a direct link to terrorism, sounds like yet more sour grapes from a disgruntled employee.

That George Bush had plans to invade Afghanistan on his desk before 9/11 demonstrates only the value of being prepared.

The suggestion that securing a pipeline across Afghanistan figured into the White House’s calculations is as ludicrous as the assertion that oil played a part in determining war in Iraq.

That Afghanistan is once again the world’s principal heroin producer is an unfortunate reality, but to claim the CIA is still actively involved in the narcotics trade is to presume bad faith on the part of the agency.

Mahmood Ahmed, chief of Pakistan’s ISI, must not have authorized an al Qaeda payment of $100,000 to Mohammed Atta days before the attacks, and was not meeting with senior Washington officials over the week of 9/11, because I didn’t read anything about him in the official report.

That Porter Goss met with Ahmed the morning of September 11 in his capacity as Chairman of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence has no bearing whatsoever upon his recent selection by the White House to head the Central Intelligence Agency.

That Goss's congressional seat encompasses the 9/11 hijackers' Florida base of operation, including their flight schools, is precisely the kind of meaningless factoid a conspiracy theorist would bring up.

It's true that George HW Bush and Dick Cheney spent the evening of September 10 alone in the Oval Office, but what's wrong with old colleagues catching up? And it's true that George HW Bush and Shafig bin Laden, Osama's brother, spent the morning of September 11 together at a board meeting of the Carlyle Group, but the bin Ladens are a big family.

That FEMA arrived in New York on Sept 10 to prepare for a scheduled biowarfare drill, and had a triage centre ready to go that was larger and better equipped than the one that was lost in the collapse of WTC 7, was a lucky twist of fate.

Newsweek’s report that senior Pentagon officials cancelled flights on Sept 10 for the following day on account of security concerns is only newsworthy because of what happened the following morning.

That George Bush's telephone logs for September 11 do not exist should surprise no one, given the confusion of the day.

That Mohamed Atta attended the International Officer's School at Maxwell Air Force Base, that Abdulaziz Alomari attended Brooks Air Force Base Aerospace Medical School, that Saeed Alghamdi attended the Defense Language Institute in Monterey merely shows it is a small world, after all.

That Lt Col Steve Butler, Vice Chancellor for student affairs of the Defense Language Institute during Alghamdi's terms, was disciplined, removed from his post and threatened with court martial when he wrote "Bush knew of the impending attacks on America. He did nothing to warn the American people because he needed this war on terrorism. What is...contemptible is the President of the United States not telling the American people what he knows for political gain," is the least that should have happened for such disrespect shown his Commander in Chief.

That Mohammed Atta dressed like a Mafioso, had a stripper girlfriend, smuggled drugs, was already a licensed pilot when he entered the US, enjoyed pork chops, drank to excess and did cocaine, was closer to Europeans than Arabs in Florida, and included the names of defence contractors on his email list, proves how dangerous the radical fundamentalist Muslim can be.

That 43 lbs of heroin was found on board the Lear Jet owned by Wally Hilliard, the owner of Atta’s flight school, just three weeks after Atta enrolled – the biggest seizure ever in Central Florida – was just bad luck. That Hilliard was not charged shows how specious the claims for conspiracy truly are.

That Hilliard’s plane had made 30-round trips to Venezuela with the same passengers who always paid cash, that the plane had been supplied by a pair of drug smugglers who had also outfitted CIA drug runner Barry Seal, and that 9/11 commissioner Richard ben-Veniste had been Seal’s attorney before Seal’s murder, shows nothing but the lengths to which conspiracists will go to draw sinister conclusions.

Reports of insider trading on 9/11 are false, because the SEC investigated and found only respectable investors who will remain nameless involved, and no terrorists, so the windfall profit-taking was merely, as ever, coincidental.

That heightened security for the World Trade Centre was lifted immediately prior to the attacks illustrates that it always happens when you least expect it.

That Hani Hanjour, the pilot of Flight 77, was so incompetent he could not fly a Cessna in August, but in September managed to fly a 767 at excessive speed into a spiraling, 270-degree descent and a level impact of the first floor of the Pentagon, on the only side that was virtually empty and had been hardened to withstand a terrorist attack, merely demonstrates that people can do almost anything once they set their minds to it.

That none of the flight data recorders were said to be recoverable even though they were located in the tail sections, and that until 9/11, no solid-state recorder in a catastrophic crash had been unrecoverable, shows how there's a first time for everything.

That Mohammed Atta left a uniform, a will, a Koran, his driver's license and a "how to fly planes" video in his rental car at the airport means he had other things on his mind.

The mention of Israelis with links to military-intelligence having been arrested on Sept 11 videotaping and celebrating the attacks, of an Israeli espionage ring surveiling DEA and defense installations and trailing the hijackers, and of a warning of impending attacks delivered to the Israeli company Odigo two hours before the first plane hit, does not deserve a response. That the stories also appeared in publications such as Ha'aretz and Forward is a sad display of self-hatred among certain elements of the Israeli media.

That multiple military wargames and simulations were underway the morning of 9/11 – one simulating the crash of a plane into a building; another, a live-fly simulation of multiple hijackings – and took many interceptors away from the eastern seaboard and confused field commanders as to which was a real hijacked aircraft and which was a hoax, was a bizarre coincidence, but no less a coincidence.

That the National Military Command Center ops director asked a rookie substitute to stand his watch at 8:30 am on Sept. 11 is nothing more than bad timing.

That a recording made Sept 11 of air traffic controllers’ describing what they had witnessed, was destroyed by an FAA official who crushed it in his hand, cut the tape into little pieces and dropped them in different trash cans around the building, is something no doubt that overzealous official wishes he could undo.

That the FBI knew precisely which Florida flight schools to descend upon hours after the attacks should make every American feel safer knowing their federal agents are on the ball.

That a former flight school executive believes the hijackers were "double agents," and says about Atta and associates, "Early on I gleaned that these guys had government protection. They were let into this country for a specific purpose," and was visited by the FBI just four hours after the attacks to intimidate him into silence, proves he's an unreliable witness, for the simple reason there is no conspiracy.

That Jeb Bush was on board an aircraft that removed flight school records to Washington in the middle of the night on Sept 12th demonstrates how seriously the governor takes the issue of national security.

To insinuate evil motive from the mercy flights of bin Laden family members and Saudi royals after 9/11 shows the sickness of the conspiratorial mindset.

Le Figaro’s report in October 2001, known to have originated with French intelligence, that the CIA met Osama bin Laden in a Dubai hospital in July 2001, proves again the perfidy of the French.

That the tape in which bin Laden claims responsibility for the attacks was released by the State Department after having been found providentially by US forces in Afghanistan, and depicts a fattened Osama with a broader face and a flatter nose, proves Osama, and Osama alone, masterminded 9/11.

That at the battle of Tora Bora, where bin Laden was surrounded on three sides, Special Forces received no order to advance and capture him and were forced to stand and watch as two Russian-made helicopters flew into the area where bin Laden was believed hiding, loaded up passengers and returned to Pakistan, demonstrates how confusing the modern battlefield can be.

That upon returning to Fort Bragg from Tora Bora, the same Special Operations troops who had been stood down from capturing bin Laden, suffered a unusual spree of murder/suicides, is nothing more than a series of senseless tragedies.

Reports that bin Laden is currently receiving periodic dialysis treatment in a Pakistani medical hospital are simply too incredible to be true.

That the White House went on Cipro September 11 shows the foresightedness of America’s emergency response.

That the anthrax was mailed to perceived liberal media and the Democratic leadership demonstrates only the perversity of the terrorist psyche.

That the anthrax attacks appeared to silence opponents of the Patriot Act shows only that appearances can be deceiving.

That the Ames-strain anthrax was found to have originated at Fort Detrick, and was beyond the capability of all but a few labs to refine, underscores the importance of allowing the investigation to continue without the distraction of absurd conspiracy theories.

That Republican guru Grover Norquist has been found to have aided financiers and supporters of Islamic terror to gain access to the Bush White House, and is a founder of the Islamic Institute, which the Treasury Department believes to be a source of funding for al Qaeda, suggests Norquist is at worst, naive, and at best, needs a wider circle of friends.

That the Department of Justice consistently chooses to see accused 9/11 plotters go free rather than permit the courtroom testimony of al Qaeda leaders in American custody looks bad, but only because we don't have all the facts.

That the White House balked at any inquiry into the events of 9/11, then starved it of funds and stonewalled it, was unfortunate, but since the commission didn't find for conspiracy it's all a non issue anyway.

That the 9/11 commission's executive director and "gatekeeper," Philip Zelikow, was so closely involved in the events under investigation that he testified before the the commission as part of the inquiry, shows only an apparent conflict of interest.

That commission chair Thomas Kean is, like George Bush, a Texas oil executive who had business dealings with reputed al Qaeda financier Khalid bin Mafouz, suggests Texas is smaller than they say it is.

That co-chair Lee Hamilton has a history as a Bush family "fixer," including clearing Bush Sr of the claims arising from the 1980 "October Surprise", is of no concern, since only conspiracists believe there was such a thing as an October Surprise.

That FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds accuses the agency of intentionally fudging specific pre-9/11 warnings and harboring a foreign espionage ring in its translation department, and claims she witnessed evidence of the semi-official infrastructure of money-laundering and narcotics trade behind the attacks, is of no account, since John Ashcroft has gagged her with the rare invocation of "State Secrets Privilege," and retroactively classified her public testimony. For the sake of national security, let us speak no more of her.

That, when commenting on Edmond's case, Daniel Ellsberg remarked that Ashcroft could go to prison for his part in a cover-up, suggests Ellsberg is giving comfort to the terrorists, and could, if he doesn't wise up, find himself declared an enemy combatant.