stryker brigade

[Punamom]

I agree, but on the other hand, I've found that if you drive the road at it's posted speed it is safe. There does seem to be a lack of traffic enforcement. I don't see the advantage of bringing the two sides together. East Hawaii will lose on that exchange. That is too far for a daily work commute and a waste of resourses. If you work in Kona you should live in Kona.
IMHO, which is probably only worth 1 cent.

Besides, some places are just too beatiful to have a major highway.

S. FL Islander to be

Edited by - oink on 10/08/2006 16:42:08

---

Is this one of your responses to stir up the pot so to speak?
Saddle road is very dangerous any time of day

The rents on Kona side are double what they are on the east side and the wages are alot more, so of course families are going to live on the east side and work in Kona, tons of people do it!These same folks also have multiple families living under the same roof just so its affordable.
The repaving is a win win for everyone (except maybe some businesses on the hamakua coast)(its also NOT going to be a major highway)
Kona area needs workers so badly they are starting programs to import people, would it not be better to make it easier for east side folks to work there.
You said East HI is like maui in the 70's how long has it been since you've been here? cause its gettin pretty crazy with the mass influx of people its definitely not the same place I moved to 5 years ago.

To the comment about there being nothing up there I heard there is a whole "underground" base.

[malolo]

Whew. Yes.
"Chalk one up for the good guys," indeed!

http://www.earthjustice.org/news/press/0...wai-i.html

http://www.kahea.org/

As for the road?
Granted, it could stand to be improved a bit I suppose.

But extending an open invitation to the military and its...hmmm, let's just say questionable...regard for the land here in the islands, is not exactly a win/win way to secure funding.

Frankly, I've always kinda fantasized about a monorail over the Saddle...with spectacular public transport on either end of the line!

[Aaron S]

Well it is the result of the circumstances that the Army is funding this re-alignment. As PTA is military installation. Hence the use of Defense Access Roads funds to do this.

It is very unlikely that the state or the county would be able to come up with entire the 220 million cost to complete this re-alignment.

Pretty much from m.m 19 to 42 is going to be built with DAR funds. The remainder, from
m.m 6 to 19 will be likely financed by the
State.

That leaves m.m 42-Malamahoa Highway. It was
uncertain how this portion would be financed.
With the Army purchasing the 24,000 acres for
the Stryker, it opened up the opportunity that this would be DAR financed too. But with
the already mentioned legal cloud- its made the latter an iffy proposition.

[Jared I]

The Army will just perform the evaluation and decide Hawaii is the place to be. My understanding is that the Army start the evaluation shortly after the first suit started, that is why they arent hemming and hawing. Because the land is already a military reservation in active use it is just a formality to push the paper work through. Two examples are Camp Pendleton and the Joint Access Training Area in the Mohave. Along the coast of Pendleton groups sued the marines for landing LCATs and performing amphi-landing training because is destroyed environment and was harmful to several protected species, the same thing happened to the Army and Marines in the Mohave. The courts sided with the govt, partially because the Marines and the Army has been such good stewarts of the land and cited that along the coast and in the desert that one reasons the species continues to flouish was partially because of the military's concern for the environment.

Look at it this way, its an arty range already how much more damage could you do? The strykers will drive over some lava and shoot some more lava. The courts were somewhat upset the Army didn't stick to the rules, so the courts slapped their hand. Its like getting a speeding ticket from a cop for 25mph in a 15mph, they dont take you licence on the spot; the Army has been given a ticket. The courts will are also asking for understanding why the training location is important, this is the same argument over here and there: "Why can't the Marines only be based at Lejeune?" "Why does the Navy need a base at Pearl Harbor, they have ports in California, Japan and on the east coast." "Why does the Army need a base on Oahu?", its simple logistics but the courts want a justification. There is already a standard of use for the location. I think the Army should ask for a full court review and keep trying to bleed earth justice dry. Strykers are much less destructive than the tanks that were used in the past on the range. I cant wait til Strykers get here and bring the SuperFerry.

Jared

[nnickle]

Look at it this way, its an arty range already how much more damage could you do? The strykers will drive over some lava and shoot some more lava. The courts were somewhat upset the Army didn't stick to the rules, so the courts slapped their hand. Its like getting a speeding ticket from a cop for 25mph in a 15mph, they dont take you licence on the spot; the Army has been given a ticket. The courts will are also asking for understanding why the training location is important, this is the same argument over here and there: "Why can't the Marines only be based at Lejeune?" "Why does the Navy need a base at Pearl Harbor, they have ports in California, Japan and on the east coast." "Why does the Army need a base on Oahu?", its simple logistics but the courts want a justification. There is already a standard of use for the location. I think the Army should ask for a full court review and keep trying to bleed earth justice dry. Strykers are much less destructive than the tanks that were used in the past on the range. I cant wait til Strykers get here and bring the SuperFerry.

Please give me where you get your info from. I bring in the fuel that the army uses and I see what happens first hand not just from reading or hearing what "the people say". I am also bringing in the lime used to make the road better.

[tada]

I recall during the 1970's Rep Abercrombie was one of the big opponents of the H3 on Oahu so sounds like he got over his fear of incurring the wrath of the gods.

I recall the lack of R'nR at Pohakuloa- supposedly there was a moviehouse and a long narrow building that was a 2 lane bowling ally- amazing what you can do with quonset huts! On their day off a couple guys climbedMaunaKea. I wish I went too- would have been the closest I would been to experiencing zero gravity.
My fav memory was jogging to the State Park to the breeding station was like going to the zoo with sheep and nene geese. Though I understand they transferred this facility to Haleakala now.
Our unit always went in October- football season and at the end of the 30 day rotation I had dreams of going to a football game on a field carved out of a lava field.

Younger folks might not understand this but in those days I thought of Hilo as like Tampico in the Humphrey Bogart movie where they got the cantina with the slowly swirling ceiling fans.

Others want to make friends- I just want to make money.
James Cramer

[malolo]

I may drifting slightly afield of the matter at hand here, but I could've sworn I read somewhere that a good-sized chunk of the Pohakuloa-lands are currently being leased from the state. Something like 25% of their massive training facility? At something like $1 per year? Or geez....was it $1 for the entire 65 year lease, I wonder?

Again, I may be remembering incorrectly, but I'm pretty sure the lease will be up in 2009, yah?

Any chance the state might be convinced to modify things a bit?

Lease the land to the military for a more rational amount perhaps?
Somewhere in the hundreds-of-millions perhaps?

Orrrr better yet, maybe lease the land in question to a group of individuals with just a wee bit more concern for Hawai'i's endangered plant and animal species? for Hawai'i's culturally-significant historical sites? for Hawai'i's land as a whole? for sayyy...a buck fifty?

~~~~~~~~~~~

Edited by - malolo on 10/08/2006 21:23:35

[oink]

quote:

---

Is this one of your responses to stir up the pot so to speak?
Saddle road is very dangerous any time of day

The rents on Kona side are double what they are on the east side and the wages are alot more, so of course families are going to live on the east side and work in Kona, tons of people do it!These same folks also have multiple families living under the same roof just so its affordable.
The repaving is a win win for everyone (except maybe some businesses on the hamakua coast)(its also NOT going to be a major highway)
Kona area needs workers so badly they are starting programs to import people, would it not be better to make it easier for east side folks to work there.
You said East HI is like maui in the 70's how long has it been since you've been here? cause its gettin pretty crazy with the mass influx of people its definitely not the same place I moved to 5 years ago.

---

Maybe, you decide.

My experience was that the road was dangerous due to excessive speeed which could be controlled by effective enforcement.

Supply and demand should eventually cause wages to go up enough to compensate for housing costs if workers can't be found.

I don't see the road widening and straightning as a win for me.

The part that has been completed looks pretty major to me. What do you want, Interstate 10?

Can't this people import program include importing residents of East Hawaii? Encouraging workers to commute long distances is a very poor energy policy for the County, State and National Government.

I was there five years ago and less than a year ago. Both of those visits involved travel all around the island, including the saddle. I drove the saddle three times last year.




S. FL Islander to be

[Kapohocat]

Although many years ago, I longed for Saddle Road to be widened and a straighter route to Kona, it may indeed be the Pandora's box John Rabi referred in a different thread/subject. The endangered species may be our fine small town community.

-Cat

[HiloHaole]

The Ninth Circus of Appeals will, most likely, be overruled by The Supreme Court.