Malama O Puna House District 4 Forum on Thursday

[james weatherford]

quote:

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Originally posted by Leilani Bronson-Crelly

Hawaii County could amend its charter

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Where in the Hawaii County Charter is there anything about road standards?

[james weatherford]

quote:

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Originally posted by Leilani Bronson-Crelly

CTAHR has an extension program funded by local, state and federal governments

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Where in the Hawaii County budget is there funding for CTHAR?

[Leilani Bronson-Crelly]

Kalakoa,

You are right. The county does seem to argue one way when the topic is roads in limbo and another when arguing that a private road must meet a certain standard. And James is right to question as to where the standards are actually defined. They are not in the charter, as I thought, nor specifically in the County Code, although dedication of lands is generally covered there. According to the Hawaii Legislative Reference Bureau, however, the dispute between state and county over roads jurisdiction began in 1963 when public highways were first separated into state and county categories.

The legal definition of a county road seems to come from H.R.S. 264-1(a) which basically says any road constructed by the government but not under the jurisdiction of DOT is a county road. Clear as mud, if you ask me. And still, no clear cut standards enumerated there either. But that definition would definitely (and conveniently) exclude our subdivision roads, which were built by the original developers (and overlooked by Planning as to quality). The bottom line seems to be money, as usual. No one wants to own the problem because then they would have to pay for it.

Again from the LRB: (1989)

"The Hawaii County Department of Public Works also submitted a proposal to resolve the disposition of certain disputed roads: specifically, the unimproved dirt roads that have never been formally planned, laid out, or constructed. Typically, these are agricultural access roads, roads to hunting areas, or roads giving access to privately-owned land parcels. The proposal suggests dividing these roads into three categories. Heavily traveled public roads would be improved to a maintenance standard and then dedicated to the county for maintenance. The State would supply the funding and the county would construct the improvements. State-owned and homestead roads inventoried and in use prior to July 1, 1990 would be maintained once annually and again upon emergency request if the county were reimbursed by the State."

Hm. Sounds good, as long as we augment that with a grant in aid program that allows fuel tax revenue to go to projects proposed by residents to improve non-State-owned and non-homestead roads.

The state should at the very least take a leadership role in all this, to clarify the law and the responsibility of the various actors. The county standards should be concrete, easy to access. Transparent. And yes, we should all begin to seriously consider a multiple-tier dedicible standards approach. A "farm-road" standard and a "county-road" standard. I don't think we ought to cede responsibility (power) to the State for crafting the standards however. The State can supply some funding, but I'd rather keep the details in the hands of the local government, and urge them to make the hard choices.

Mahalo, Kalakoa and Oink, and James, for challenging me on this issue. This does warrant my close attention. The State and the county need to stop pretending this is not a government issue.



Leilani Bronson-Crelly
Candidate for State House Representative, District 4
www.Vote4Leilani.com

[Leilani Bronson-Crelly]

Aloha James!

I don't think I specifically said that CTAHR was funded by Hawaii County (although they might be, I just don't know).

According to the CTAHR website:

"The CTAHR Cooperative Extension Service (CES) is ... a partnership between federal, state, and local governments and has responsibility for providing science-based information and educational programs in agriculture, natural resources, and human resources.

"Each county’s extension program is overseen by a CTAHR administrator who is responsible for all CTAHR resources and activities in the county. About 65 dedicated county extension agents and specialists currently conduct our extension work, with the assistance of many additional support personnel throughout the state.

"Most of the extension agents and many of the specialists are University of Hawai‘i faculty members who work from off-campus extension offices. County agents are available for individual consultations and can provide educational workshops and short-courses covering topics in agriculture, home economics, family living, 4-H and other youth activities, nutrition, and health."



Leilani Bronson-Crelly
Candidate for State House Representative, District 4
www.Vote4Leilani.com

[kalakoa]

where the standards are actually defined

County Code 23-41 "Minimum right-of-way and pavement widths." requires minimum 24-feet pavement on 50-foot easement for a "minor" street. Section 23-86 stipulates the necessary minimum pavement for any street to become dedicable.

the dispute between state and county over roads jurisdiction began in 1963

At which point many "private" subdivision roads already existed... as well as the County Code requirement that the roads actually be constructed prior to final subdivision plat approval. This obviously did not happen.

any road constructed by the government ... and overlooked by Planning as to quality

I would argue that the road is then implicitly constructed by government's failure to require that their own standards be followed.

No one wants to own the problem because then they would have to pay for it.

...which is very expensive if you have to meet the one and only standard for a "dedicable" road.

I'm assuming that the roads "problem" won't be solved in my lifetime -- but until then, we need stronger mandatory disclosure, statewide, all current and future landowners whose property does not have access via public road or highway need to sign an agreement acknowledging that payment of dues or taxes does not guarantee infrastructure, utilities, or emergency response.

While the County sticks their fingers in their ears and mutters "can't maintain private road, buyer to perform due diligence, problem created too long ago, too expensive to fix now, la la la", people keep moving to Puna anyway[i], and some of those who live here are getting old [i]and might need an ambulance. If the problem won't be solved, let's formalize that so we can all make future plans, and let's save the newcomers lots of time and effort hoping in vain for the roads to ever be paved.

[BI-Curious]

I'm proud and happy to support Leilani. She's smart, she's passionate, and she is committed to positive change.
Leilani, I hope you will schedule more public forums to get the word out about your candidacy. Oh, and pomaika`i!
#TeamLeilani

[PauHana]

Home Economics use to be a central function of the CTAHR Extension Service which appears to have been forgotten. That's what the HR in CTAHR represents.

It is my understanding the Extension Service never replaced a Home Economics Extension agent in Hilo, when the exceptional Betty Jo Thompson retired.

Hawaii's families could really use instruction on how to budget their family expenses, cooking nutritional meals, and fundamentals of consumer credit.

Families stuck in the vicious rut of payday loans, pawn shops, and rent to own, need to be shown a way out.

Kids who grew up on instant cakes and frozen steaks don't know how to do anything else, so their money doesn't go very far.

The analogy to giving someone a fish versus teaching one how to fish would apply here.

If you want to make a difference at the ground level perhaps we should investigate bringing that program back.

[kalakoa]

clarify the law and the responsibility of the various actors

I would also like some transparency from State DOT, especially given that County leverages them to mitigate growth.

Example: 9 acres of sorely-needed commercial real estate in Pahoa which can't open until the roundabout is finished; DOT was supposed to break ground last year, but nothing seems to be happening.

[pahoated]

quote:

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Originally posted by kalakoa

clarify the law and the responsibility of the various actors

I would also like some transparency from State DOT, especially given that County leverages them to mitigate growth.

Example: 9 acres of sorely-needed commercial real estate in Pahoa which can't open until the roundabout is finished; DOT was supposed to break ground last year, but nothing seems to be happening.

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You are making statements as if they are fact, when they are not.

You are talking about the new shopping center. The county bill doesn't say the roundabout has to be finished, it says there is a light required at the intersection before it opens. You will see that it's being cleared now. The bill says the new shopping center can't be opened until the roundabout is finished. This does not say the roundabout has to be finished before construction of the shopping center can commence. What some people are thinking is the effect of the law, meaning construction is delayed, must not be from around here. Those waste treatment tanks have to go deep into the ground, and as discussed under the Fence topic, have to be put in lava rock, sometimes blue rock, sometimes finding a lava tube only a few feet down. Seriously, anybody living here for any amount of time should know this drill. Getting the land prepared takes a lot longer here than the mainland.

Why is it so many people obsess over this and fail to mention the roundabout is going into the wrong intersection, that it should be at the top of Kahakai, a proper 4-way for a roundabout, and by putting the roundabout there, the infamous T-section is removed? Oh well. That's the motto in Puna.

"This island Hawaii on this island Earth"

[kalakoa]

The bill says the new shopping center can't be opened until the roundabout is finished.

What I said: "can't open until the roundabout is finished".

Bill 120, section 2(N): "As agreed to by the applicant, a Certificate of Occupancy shall not be issued ... until DOT intersection improvement project ... has been completed."

Section 2(D) stipulates that "Construction of the development shall be completed within 5 years from the effective date of this ordinance."

Bill 120 was passed on 11/20/2013, which was to have been after DOT started construction of the roundabout. As of today, DOT has yet to break ground; there aren't even survey stakes. Will DOT be finished by 11/20/2018? (Who knows, they're not telling.)

This is exactly what I mean by "County leveraging State to slow development", and it works extremely well -- in previous instances, applicant simply withdrew their request.