The Secret's out about Pahala's biofuel plant

[Rob Tucker]

Hey, when you find that "free" electricity let me know.

Ever hear of TANSTAAFL?

[silverpenny10]

OK, so it's an initial investment for solar panels (you can even make your own rather inexpensively) or wind generator (there are instructions for making your own), but being off grid means NO dependency on power companies. Isn't everyone tired of monthly bills? Guess what? Many of them can be eliminated. Yes, eliminated. The sun is FREE and it gives most every day here in HI. Wind says it doesn't charge a dime and it's prolific in certain areas too. The more we think we're dependent, the less free we are. The more monthly bills we eliminate, the less dependent we are, the less our obsession with "jobs" to pay "bills", the more we can enjoy life, the more free we are. Isn't this what we all strive for? It's even more reachable here in HI with nice weather, plenty sunshine, plenty ag land for growing food, good soil (some work needs to be done to replenish the soil from previous raping of the land by irresponsible agribusiness, but it can be done), plenty water. Isn't this paradise? If not, then I was sold a bad bill of goods 50+ years ago and want my money back.

[wjbillock]

quote:

---

Originally posted by silverpenny10

Electricity is FREE, from solar, wind, geothermal, etc...

---

FREE...really? You honestly think so? REALLY?

Solar...hmmm...works only when the sun is shining...need to store it's energy for evenings and cloudy days...hmmm...how to do that...oh...ok...buy batteries...those are FREE!!!! But wait...then there's maintenance on the batteries...and they don't last forever...maybe 4 years...but no matter...they're FREE!! Hmmm...shipping batteries to Hawaii...if you order more than $25 from Amazon.com...they ship FREE!!! Yeah...that's the ticket we'll buy our batteries from Amazon!

Wind....hmmm...works only when the wind is blowing and not reliable enough to sustain full-time production...hmmm...how to do that...see storage above...remember...it's FREE!!!

Geothermal...hmmm...gotta drill a hole...inject water (which is free)..and then catch the steam that escapes (not to mention steam is taxed as mineral rights from the state)...turns a turbine(those are free). Gotta maintain the turbines...and make sure they don't rust...and of course all the good folks at Puna Geothermal are volunteers...and they work for FREE....

Hmmmmm...I guess Mr Tucker is right...TANSTAAFL!

"What? Me Worry?" - Alfred E. Newman

[silverpenny10]

wjbillock and others: how much do you pay for electricity per month? I guess all this talk about sustainability is all just a big hoax then. I guess all the people who are off grid are just stupid then.

TANSTAAFL: the eggs from my chickens are free (they didn't ask for money when they were laying- we have an understanding). So were the chickens hatched from eggs, save for the first batch that I got from my neighbor. The fruits dripping off my trees are free. So are the vegies in my garden since I save all seeds. Free is good.

[wjbillock]

silverpenny...I certainly would not call you stupid for living off grid...I applaud your efforts.

I simply believe that a statement like "electricity is free" is silly...thus my "silly" response.

"What? Me Worry?" - Alfred E. Newman

[silverpenny10]

Sorry, I should've been more specific in stating that the resources to generate free energy are available.

[David M]

Dang, I was hoping for the secret to "free" so I could maybe sell all my off grid stuff and get my money back.

David

Ninole Resident

[mdd7000]

quote:

---

Originally posted by silverpenny10

mdd7000: "What do you not understand? It would be fuel to produce your electricity, instead of using imported coal and oil.
This land is not producing food, nor has been, nor will be. Sugarcane wasn't food."

What do YOU not understand? Electricity is FREE, from solar, wind, geothermal, etc...Why spray more toxic chemicals into the air/ocean unnecessarily? Instead of poisoning our environment, instead of reliance on imports, instead of endless gluttony, why not reduce usage and practice sustainability?

Sugarcane wasn't food??? LOL!!! What do you put in your coffee to sweeten it? The pink, blue, or yellow packets?

All this talk about jobs for Kau is nonsense. People who want jobs live in Kona, Hilo. People who choose to live in Kau do it because they like the rustic open space. I wouldn't move to Kau if I was looking for a job. What do YOU not understand?

---

Where do you get the idea that "toxic chemicals" are going to be used? Do you know this for a fact, or is another one of your "sky is falling" tactics? Are these chemicals, if any, going to be any more toxic than the arsenic, which was used on the sugarcane lands?

Are your cows now eating arsenic-laden grass? Do you want others to have cows grazing on that land? I don't.

I take my coffee black, and we buy almost zero sugar.

What about all of those local, true Hawaiians that have lived in Kau for generations and are struggling? They aren't big landowners like you. Don't you think they might like to have decent jobs? Do they not deserve decent jobs for their families? Do you think they should have to move in order to support their families?

PS - electricity is not "free". It costs money to buy the equipment to produce it and maintain it. People have to have jobs to make the money to have "free" electricity.

[silverpenny10]

mdd7000,
Do you know for a fact that toxic chemicals/pesticide are NOT going to be used or are you sold on the party line? There are eucalyptus farms here in Hamakua that people have spoken out against heavy use of agrochemicals, particularly in the initial phases of development. So, are you saying that if the chemicals are not as bad as arsenic, that it would be OK? That's like saying you'd vote for Enriques just to spite me, although he's been proven a crook. That's like saying sugarcane is not food and just because you don't buy sugar makes it true. That's like stating as fact that I'm a big landowner although you don't know me. Just like your false assumptions about others on another thread. It's good to learn from your mistakes, you know.

True Hawaiians who have lived in Kau for generations hunt, fish, farm. What decent jobs are you referring to? Changing sheets and cleaning hotel rooms or poison techs and boom sprayers? Yes, this is what we all hope for our children and grandchildren.

[MarkP]

Electricity from wind and solar energy is not remotely free. It clearly costs more than HELCO,s power. If not, everyone would have it already. There are good reasons to jump through the hoops to have your own supply but cheapness isn't actually one of them, unless you are making do with a very small amount of power compared to someone in town. By the time you make the lifestyle changes necessary to live off of solar or wind you won't be thinking so much about the money.

Not saying I couldn't use solar panels in Eden Roc, but I would have to install twice as many since it is so cloudy and rainy.

Solar would be the most widely available resource. Good wind is much rarer. A good wind resource is indeed rare so you shouldn't lead people on thinking they can depend on wind.