Roads Are Easements Not Planned Communities Or HOAs

[Patricia]

The chair of each committee shall seek prior
approval by the board for the actions of the committee.

The actions of the bylaws committee are outlined in the bylaws. There is a process. The 2018 BLC followed the process;

The BLC took the bylaw amendments to the 2018 February owners/members meeting.

Prior to taking the the amendments to the 2018 February owners/members meeting, the BLC reported to the board. 

The BLC having reported to the board and having shared the Bylaw amendments with the board, prior to the February 2018 owners/members meeting, then had the vote for the bylaw amendments PLACED ON THE 2018 owners/members AGENDA.

The 2018 BLC presented the proposed bylaw amendments to, in excess of, 100 owners/members at the 2018 February meeting.

The 2018 proposed amendments were then voted on by the owners/members and passed.

Whereby, the voted on and approved bylaws amendments were then forwarded to the HPPOA board (again) who then stated that they would seek legal review 

However, the HPPOA board, from 2018 until NOW, has NEVER sought or acquired legal review regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments.

The HPPOA board NEVER completed the process, as outlined in the bylaws, regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments

The 2018 owners/members vote, regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments, STILL STANDS

The current board MUST finish the process that was started. And they MUST share any legal "review" with owners/members regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments. 

In addition, any motions made since 2018, regarding the bylaws that are in conflict or entail the SAME  bylaw sections that were already voted on and approved in 2018 are null and void. 

The 2018 motions are VALID and were recognized by the HPPOA board. (Otherwise, why bother with legal review?)

THIS HPPOA board needs to honor the process as outlined in the bylaws.

---

Can you read and understand that the person who wrote the bylaw, explained it to the Membership.

Nancy Cabral was not referring to the Bylaws Committee or the February 2018 bylaw amendments (context matters).

Nancy was referring to the Professional Management Research Committee, a committee that was looking for and recommending professional management (something the HPPOA board has always been against).

"Terri Stratton moved that the HPP (sic) Membership Professional Management Research Committee continue to work with Day-Lum Propert Management to get a full proposal and breakdown of cost relating to the road management and related business. Sandra Collins seconded the motion. 

Discussion: There was a question about whether the Chair went to the board... 

A long discussion: More information would be needed for further action by Day-Lum or any other possible management company to make an assessment to bid and that further information would have to be approved for release by the board.

THIS WAS REGARDING HIRING PROFESSIONAL MANAGEMENT NOT ABOUT THE 2018 BYLAW AMENDMENTS

---

You can’t have it both ways.

You are correct, KP you can't.
(And for clarification, I do not think Mr. Hamano would agree with you about he and I being friends.)

This board cannot amend bylaws, with their illegal bylaws committee and not follow the bylaw process.

The 2018 bylaw amendments were voted on, approved, and the board accepted them- next step "legal review."

Let's see that legal review.

And THEN, those 2018 bylaw amendments need to go back to the owners/members AGAIN for reconsideration.  THAT is the process

[Obie]

HPP BOD Meeting Minutes – November 21, 2018

. Bylaws Review
The bylaws clearly state that the bylaws committee has to bring their recommendations for changes to the Board before it’s brought to the membership.
A lengthy discussion occurred. All membership committees are advisory and the Board makes decisions. It was noted that one of the recommended
changes in the conflict of interest section would nullify the entire community from being on the board. Article 11, Section 3 page 19 discussed.
Break at 9:30 p.m. to move from Kitchen into Library
Back in at 9:38 p.m.
Bylaws Review discussion continued with Mayelin insisting the recommended bylaws changes be sent out immediately.
Tanya Seaver reported from her reading of the minutes that the bylaws committee was created to amend a couple things in the bylaws for the Board at
that time, but the Bylaws Committee returned and instead stated that they wanted to do the changes wholly, and then present all their recommended
changes at one time. At that time they stated it was in order to save cost to the Association and to better make sense of the Bylaws so that they had
parity, but now the Bylaws committee has come back without the original changes they were tasked to change and they are asking for only four
recommended changes to be sent to the membership rather than all their changes that they’ve been working on for years since originally being tasked
to make a couple changes to present that still haven’t been offered to the Board.
Mayelin stated that they’re not saying they’ve made all the changes, but no, instead, she stated they’ve found an open door “so we decided instead of
going through the whole dang thing we could get professional management instead” so we, in the Bylaws Committee, decided to give the membership
that option instead.
The committee has come back with only four changes, after years of us getting reports from the Bylaws committee of how they’d made it to this section
or that, but now Mayelin stated that she and those in the committee changed that. Mayelin stated that “now we’re thinking, why go all the way to the end
and not incorporate bylaws that would accommodate professional management.” If they vote for professional management, then certain bylaws have to
be changed, “so why change five to seven things if we’re going to go backwards” and do those other changes? The Bylaws Committee wants to go
ahead and spend $5,000 to $7,000 for mailings to send out only four changes, instead of an entire completed recommendation of changes for all the
sections as previously reported was the plan for several years and hence was now the reason why they never did the three changes they were originally
tasked to do when they were created.
The GM noted that the bylaws actually do already encompass professional management. We all have an indirect financial interest and the promoted
conflict of interest bylaw change would require the entire board to step down and the one professional management company currently being
considered would also not be useable due to that newly suggested bylaw change because the owner of Daylum also owns a lot in HPP.
Mayelin then went on to state that an attorney looked at the proposed Bylaws changes and they are fine. It was noted that the Board still hasn’t seen
anything in writing to this effect. In attempting to defend this point Mary Couch stated that she was just listening today to her private recording of the
Executive Session Meeting Minutes and this revelation stopped all conversation to direct attention to the illegality of her having recordings when no one
is supposed to be recording Executive session minutes except the Recording Secretary. A discussion ensued. Mayelin asked to show her where it is
that she can’t record Executive session meetings.
The committee advises the board. It is in the bylaws. Article 10 Section 1B was read: The committees of the Board are elected by the membership…are
advisory…and their recommendations are subject to review and approval of the board.
The board has a fiduciary duty to not spend $6,000 on mailing out changes for three things when they can spend that same cost for all the changes at
once. David Roe (District 9) moved to have Newton Chu come in and have this discussion for all. Tanya Seaver (District 4) seconded the
motion. Discussion: It was noted by a board member that the changes on the paper presented to the board now is different than the changes presented
at the General Membership meeting. One of the proposed bylaw changes was read and it give huge power to the bylaws committee to amend the
bylaws anytime they want to without oversight from the board or anyone. The Bylaws Committee wants full power with their proposed change. The GM
stated that per the bylaws the board has absolute power.
David Roe (District 9) stated that they had a paid consult with Steinberg and discussed whether the BOD has the right to make changes as we see fit
based on membership input and his response was basically whoever holds the purse strings makes the rules. Anything that the Board feels they have a
fiduciary to modify in the interest of the association. No one can do anything on a committee without board approval.

[Punatang]

I actually miss Ironyak.

[Obie]

"2018 bylaw amendments were voted on, approved, and the board accepted them- next step "legal review."

Let's see that legal review."

The board never accepted them and in fact had never seen them prior to the Membership meeting.

[Punatang]

Obie, with the greatest respect, if you really wanted Patricia to "please go away" you would stop engaging, replying, provoking and encouraging her to continue.  Apparently you enjoy this as much as she does.  

Sure we could all just ignore this thread about as much as one can ignore a screaming child throwing a tantrum at a party of adults.  All of you please go away.  Seriously.  It's enough.

[Patricia]

The board never accepted them and in fact had never seen them prior to the Membership meeting.

Says who?

The January board minutes state, BLC report submitted in writing. But guess what? No report attached. Typical HPPOA move.

The February board minutes do not mention the BLC at all. I wonder why?

[KPHawaii]

The chair of each committee shall seek prior
approval by the board for the actions of the committee.

The actions of the bylaws committee are outlined in the bylaws. There is a process. The 2018 BLC followed the process;

The BLC took the bylaw amendments to the 2018 February owners/members meeting.

Prior to taking the the amendments to the 2018 February owners/members meeting, the BLC reported to the board. 

The BLC having reported to the board and having shared the Bylaw amendments with the board, prior to the February 2018 owners/members meeting, then had the vote for the bylaw amendments PLACED ON THE 2018 owners/members AGENDA.

The 2018 BLC presented the proposed bylaw amendments to, in excess of, 100 owners/members at the 2018 February meeting.

The 2018 proposed amendments were then voted on by the owners/members and passed.

Whereby, the voted on and approved bylaws amendments were then forwarded to the HPPOA board (again) who then stated that they would seek legal review 

However, the HPPOA board, from 2018 until NOW, has NEVER sought or acquired legal review regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments.

The HPPOA board NEVER completed the process, as outlined in the bylaws, regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments

The 2018 owners/members vote, regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments, STILL STANDS

The current board MUST finish the process that was started. And they MUST share any legal "review" with owners/members regarding the 2018 bylaw amendments. 

In addition, any motions made since 2018, regarding the bylaws that are in conflict or entail the SAME  bylaw sections that were already voted on and approved in 2018 are null and void. 

The 2018 motions are VALID and were recognized by the HPPOA board. (Otherwise, why bother with legal review?)

THIS HPPOA board needs to honor the process as outlined in the bylaws.

---

---

You can’t have it both ways.

You are correct, KP you can't.
(And for clarification, I do not think Mr. Hamano would agree with you about he and I being friends.)

This board cannot amend bylaws, with their illegal bylaws committee and not follow the bylaw process.

The 2018 bylaw amendments were voted on, approved, and the board accepted them- next step "legal review."

Let's see that legal review.

And THEN, those 2018 bylaw amendments need to go back to the owners/members AGAIN for reconsideration.  THAT is the process

Would you suggest IF they send them to the attorneys and IF the attorneys approve them and IF the membership votes again we send them out to everyone, that would be a prudent decision, since the bylaws are being changed as we speak and some of those expensive bylaw changes will more than likely be changed again? Then the process has to go through the same approvals and mailing? If that were your personal bank account is that how you’d do it? Since it wasn’t handle properly 7 years ago maybe it’s best to wait until the current revisions are voted on and start the process over. Sometimes it’s in everyone’s best interest to use common sense and move on.

Is there something in those changes that haven’t been approved by the attorneys, that is so important it can’t wait? Do you know of the current committee has reviewed and taken into consideration those proposed changes?

---

Can you read and understand that the person who wrote the bylaw, explained it to the Membership.

Nancy Cabral was not referring to the Bylaws Committee or the February 2018 bylaw amendments (context matters).

Nancy was referring to the Professional Management Research Committee, a committee that was looking for and recommending professional management (something the HPPOA board has always been against).

"Terri Stratton moved that the HPP (sic) Membership Professional Management Research Committee continue to work with Day-Lum Propert Management to get a full proposal and breakdown of cost relating to the road management and related business. Sandra Collins seconded the motion. 

Discussion: There was a question about whether the Chair went to the board... 

A long discussion: More information would be needed for further action by Day-Lum or any other possible management company to make an assessment to bid and that further information would have to be approved for release by the board.

THIS WAS REGARDING HIRING PROFESSIONAL MANAGEMENT NOT ABOUT THE 2018 BYLAW AMENDMENTS

What are you trying to say?

---

HPP BOD Meeting Minutes – November 21, 2018
Bylaws Review

Great information on the BOD meeting November 2018 Obie. Looks like someone might want to do a little more homework.

[Patricia]

In August of 2018 the board FINALLY voted to send out the amended bylaws ballots.....

"E. Bylaws Committee Ballot – They need a board vote to get the ballot mailed out. They want approval of postage and printing. It will be going to entire membership. Could it be mailed with the Conch? Concern it might be tossed not realizing it’s not junk mail. Ballot enclosed could be stamped on the Conch to alert people. Mary Couch (District 2) moved to include the Bylaws Committee Ballot with the Conch stamped “ballot enclosed” and if merging needs done, volunteers will support the office to do it. Leslie Blyth (District 7) seconded the motion. Vote: Yes-4, No-0, Abstain-1 (Tanya Seaver/District 4).  Motion carried."

WHAT HAPPENED?

[Moderator 2]

All of you please go away.  Seriously.  It's enough.

If I had to choose between a root canal without anesthetic and rereading this thread from start to finish I’d take the root canal.  Even if I didn’t need one.

[KPHawaii]

All of you please go away.  Seriously.  It's enough.

If I had to choose between a root canal without anesthetic and rereading this thread from start to finish I’d take the root canal.  Even if I didn’t need one.

Some of us have been dealing with this for 3+ years. She wants to make everyone so miserable they go away. I have texts from her saying exactly that. That’s why we don’t give in.

She has been removed from most FaceBook groups and Nextdoor, the APP. Now she’s found PW. 

I’m ready for that root canal too.