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I just finished building my 720 sq ft cottage in HPP.. it took more time to get a permit and approved plans than it did to get the thing roofed and dried in... Passed elec. and plumbing, first call for foundation failed because of an added 3ft roof overhang.. I had to have a complete new set of plans,engineering,etc.. that took another 5-6 weeks to get approved.. called for final the next day and passed no problem...But it cost me 4-5k to build it with the County's oversight.. I see that price growing considerably in the near future
“It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.” " Krishnamurti "
“It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.” " Krishnamurti "
Posts: 1,839
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Joined: May 2007
All of this building code crap is coming from Insurance Co. Lobbyists.
Posts: 2,466
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Joined: May 2008
The unions may have a little something to do with it also.
Puna: Our roosters crow first
Posts: 243
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Joined: Oct 2005
AK Pilot,
Bumping this forward for you about non-permitted issues. Lots of other threads from earlier dates about this same subject. You might note the possible difficulties surrounding electricity. It is supplied with a temporary pole, which rates are much higher than regular electric, which happens after the house gets finaled. Also the electricity could get shut off, usually does not happen, but is possible.
Lucy
Having another Great day in Paradise, Wherever that Maybe!
Lucy
Having another Great day in Paradise, Wherever that Maybe!
Posts: 2,490
Threads: 222
Joined: Dec 2005
Lucy,
The only way your going to get a "temp" pole is by getting a permit. Helco will not even talk to you about with out a building a permit. There is always spending 5-10K on solar and telling Helco where to stick their high electricity costs...Probably a good idea anyway weather you have a permit or not. The only way your going to get yanked off of Temp Power ... Is if you run into your temp pole with your car (after your temp time has ran out) and call helco about it. That is the only time I have heard of someone getting cut off of temp power.
Tho, I'm sure there are other times where due to the pole rotting out and falling down over 20 odd years.
quote:
Originally posted by Carey
Durian, although this is an interesting analogy...one of the main drivers for building codes are catastrophic failures... recently we have seen the call in other counties for more stringent building regulations after earthquakes & people loading failures caused hundreds of deaths. Chicago has had one of the toughest building codes for over a century...established after the extreme devastation of the Chicago fire (no matter what theory you believe for the start of the fire, the spread of the fire was not cow caused, but because of the way the buildings were built with no firestops within or between the buildings)
This is also a question that is being mulled an a global scale, should the poor be relegated to housing that would not be safe for the more well to do...with the increased hazards of structural & electrical failures and unsafe sanitation... if not, how to make sure that all have access to safe housing...
I am also not sure that the house of cards should be considered the best structure that the owners could build... there is an obvious use of materials (cost) & effort to build up, rather than build well. Any time you build a structure up, you increase the cost of the structure & increase the complexity....
Blah, the only reason building codes exist is because of lobbyists and the overlords they serve. This isn't about safety, this is about more money to the wealthy. I agree with Durian 100% We don't ballon frame buildings anymore and if you were in the trades you might know that.
quote:
Originally posted by Rob Tucker
Yeah, it is interesting isn't it....
Got lobbyist friends do ya?
quote:
Originally posted by Kapohocat
quote:
Originally posted by Carey...
If you do not like the codes, voice your concerns, but have well researched, documented reasons to back up your concerns....and it really helps to have a number of other well reasoned members of the community backing you.... a well researched & reasoned argument that is backed documentation & by the community at large.... believe it or not, that works for most of the people, even in our local government.
In regards to our building codes, many well seasoned members of the building community - architects/draftspeople/licensed contractors did express their well researched and reasonable concerns .. to no avail it seems.
Even I, located between layman and expert, can see the glaring stupidity of the code approved by the county council last week.
Here, here...I agree 100% with Kapohocat. Lobbyists have more pwer than people. The wealthy get their money by making it the law to pay them.
quote:
Originally posted by Carey
Chicago was in the forefront of building codes BECAUSE of the devastation of the great fire, & the populace was requesting (demanding) it... not because anyone believed that the code itself would make everything all better... Codes do set a community standard, one that the community does set (believe it or not, most everyone here does have the choice & chance voice their concerns for things like the building code to people we VOTE into office....) Very few municipalities vote in a building code carte blanc... those changes they make are ones that community members have had a voice in, if your voice was not taken into consideration... then it is up to you....
When I worked for UL, it was amazing how certain municipalities passed building code upgrades & more stringent regulations AFTER a major incident happened within their jurisdiction...
in the end, you can only do what you can do... but to use the house of cards as any example of acceptable, good, or 'best anyone could build for their money' building is not something I think would be at the top of anyones list ... but some posters here must think that it is...
If you do not like the codes, voice your concerns, but have well researched, documented reasons to back up your concerns....and it really helps to have a number of other well reasoned members of the community backing you.... a well researched & reasoned argument that is backed documentation & by the community at large.... believe it or not, that works for most of the people, even in our local government.
I'm not swallowing that pill...it takes a guillable person to believe that. What does Chicago have to do with Hawaii if Nanook's story isn't valid in Hawaii? Are you a lobbyist?
quote:
Originally posted by ponopony
Help, we need some advice. My wife and I have been planning for years to build a small house or cabin on the Big Island. We'd probably do it unpermitted, due to our limited savings. I'm a handy-man with building experience, so I think we can manage. (and I'd probably build it better than code.)
We plan to have a small farm on 1-3 acres, just the basics, and nothing illegal... We would be very respectful to any neighbors and the aina. But we would hate to be constantly looking over our shoulder, and live in fear to get fined or shut down.
We've seen a lot of unpermitted shacks all over. And to some, our 'cabin' might be considered up-scale. But without permits, we're nervous about skirting local regulations, and what doing so might entail.
We lived in Hawaii for a while, so we're familiar with many things. But the reality of owning something unpermitted is unclear, for example:
1.) If we live in an unpermitted home, can we have an address? (I know most use PO boxes.)
2.) If we don't have a home address, won't that be a problem? Can we get a driver's license, etc.?
3.) If a nasty neighbor calls the county on us, could they condemn our home? (I know local gov't doesn't actively search for unpermitted dwellings, but...)
4.) Since banks don't give loans for unpermitted properties, could we sell it in the future? We probably couldn't offer financing.
5.) Would it be better to build an Argus/HPM package garage/Ag-shed WITH a permit? (and finish it after the permit is finaled)
6.) ...anything we're not thinking of??
Mahalo for your thoughts!
Do it the way you want to.
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