VICTORY in sight for Gay Civil Unions

[silverpenny10]

Rob,
I meant that as a general comment, as lover, follower, etc...not directed at anyone.

[silverpenny10]

Equality for all.

[Ed Smay]

quote:

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Originally posted by kalama boy

Dugger, my views on the subject are formed more by nature itself than anything else.
Homosexuality is a known evolutionary deadend.

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For some this might be right but I am gay, have 2 children and 7 grandchildren. Not true for me!

"From knowledge comes understanding"

[Carey]

As I alluded to, and Rob clearly stated, the civil union bill is not at all about sexual preference, It is a legal venue to give a set of legal rights.

Civil unions are a single process that gives a legal means to many rights and responsibilities between two people (these are almost impossible to neatly tie together in any other legal means other than the legal process of civil marriage). It has nothing to do with anything sexual. It can create a legal hanai situation between an older adult and a younger adult, much like adoption would for a child (would you want a true adult hanai son or daughter to have to marry an older person for the ability to guide caregiving and emergency visitation?). It can create a legal bond for two people that includes right of inheritance, and even rights to be with that other person in times of emergency and/or caregiving, something that is not easily granted in the legal venues.

[kalama boy]

Mahalo Rob, I appreciate your input and agree with your post. Would the same hold true for a 70 year old related couple?

Dugger, I believe in a creator but I also believe in evolution. When did the evolutionary process start? That is a question that each individual needs to answer for themselves.
I also disagree with you that being gay is not a choice, I believe it is.

Hawaiideborah, Every human that has ever walked the Earth was conceived from the pairing of one man and one woman. Why is that, is it just natures way? No matter how you spin it, a gay couple cannot produce offspring together.

Everyone, for the record, I do not hate or fear gay people, I just disagree with their lifestyle choice.

[Bob Orts]

quote:

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Originally posted by konadave

I'll support this bill if it is the only way to allow equal treatment under the law but really I think it would make a bigger impact if the bill just re-words whatever law prohibits civil unions to homosexuals. Why? Because if this bill just overrides the current law then the current law as it is written is still on the books. It doesn't go away. Maybe it sounds like semantics to some but to me but I am a firm believer in all laws being applied equally to all. JMHO

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And, that is the essence of the Bill.

A marriage license is just a license issued by the state based on when executed, a legally binding contract exist. Can you imagine the uproar if a residential lease required only two adults of opposite sex? How about if two people wanted a business license and it required that they be of opposite sex. Why not require those obtaining a drivers license to be forced to only transport people of the opposite sex.

Nowhere in Hawaii law is there a requirement that married people have sex, agree to have sex, or have rights above any other couple when it comes to sex.

Nowhere in Hawaii law is their a requirement that married couples have children, agree to have children, or have rights above what any other couple has when it comes to children.

No where in Hawaii law is religion a part of marriage.

The state issues a license for marriage and it can be civil, religious, cultural, social, and ethnical. The church and religion has no bearing on marriage. That is why two atheists can legally be marriage even though they have zero religious affiliation, have no plans on having sex, and hates children. Likewise two devout religious people can get married and still not have sex, children or any of the other baggage tied to religious ceremony.

Since the ceremony of marriage can be either civil or religious, that's the couple’s decision and is no indication of an assumed outcome. Two Catholics can get married in a religious ceremony by the Church of Fork Over The Dough Cause The Rev Wants A New BMW, and live the religious ways of Judaism (or renounce all religion) and its still legal.

So why are some people so afraid of allowing a state license for two people of the same sex, that has nothing sexual about it, yet those people always use sex as an excuse? The only thing I can see is they want the enjoyment of those protections for themselves but won’t extend equal protection to others - OR - they are closet homosexuals and are afraid that their pool of available partners will be reduced if marriage commitments are followed. Based on the arguments many have made, I think they are really homo's themselves.

[Kapohocat]

quote:

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Homosexuality is a known evolutionary deadend.

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hmmmm... I think we have discussed this before but homosexuality is found in nature and serves a purpose with the reproduction of species, even the human one. Google "helper male". Or just watch "queer eye for the straight guy". it simply is not a dead-end IMHO.

okay back to regular programming.

[dugger]

Kalama, thank you for your honest answer. Just curious, why do you think anyone would choose to be gay? It simply makes no sense. If they have the desire to be with someone of the same sex, then conscious choice is not the question. If they don't have the desire, why go in that direction. To say it is a choice just has no logical basis.

[robguz]

More endless trolling on the same subject by the usual suspect. Booooorrrrrriiiiiing!

[JerryCarr]

Ah yes, the old "choose to be gay" thing again. When one of my very conservative, very religious cousins in Texas started the "it's a choice" argument with me a long time ago, legal and social persecution as well as beatings of gays were still common there. I had to say, "Oh yeah, that's right. One day I decided that I just didn't have enough people in this world who wanted to beat me up, throw me out of my profession, throw me into jail, and generally make life miserable for me, so I joined the homosexuals." That shut him up.