CRIMINAL penalties for non-permitted buildings!

[Wao nahele kane]

Comparatively speaking what we have now in the home construction industry is liken to a system that allows the manufacturers of the sub components within an aircraft to dictate how an aircraft will be built. In the reality the aircraft building business, it's the manufacturers/engineers of the aircraft that have power over how the aircraft are built and not the companies that manufacture the parts for the aircraft.
We've now allowed the sub component manufacturers to dictate how a home/building is built.

- Armed citizens provide security of a free State.

[Kapohocat]

quote:

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Originally posted by Bullwinkle

case law:

recently an architect in L.A. (His own home) was arrested. His design included a non code approved false chimney that caught fire - the fireman responding lost his life when the unapproved addition collapsed underneath him

law of unintended consequences - in this case violating code will lead to prison term.

1 year: update http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/01/0...refighter/

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One more thing, as I heard the LA Bldg dept requires plastic piping of the water for the sprinklers (PVC, CPVC?) and when that pipe was in the attic it eventually melted causing the water to pool in the attic and then the weight of the water collapsed the floors/ceilings above the firefighter.

While the origin of the fire they say was the fireplace installation, this above item was probably the actual cause of the collapse. I.e the perfect storm.

ETA: along with all the code changes in Hawaii I believe we need to have real certified inspectors. A few yrs ago, I believe Marc Jacobsen was our only certified inspector and now he has left the Dept.

[Bullwinkle]

have never heard of plastic being approved for fire - criminal

[Bullwinkle]

here is the cpvc standard - crazy - note for light occupancy ul approved have yet to see ubc approval

http://www.harvel.com/technical-support-...nkler-pipe

learn something every day - I would not advise using plastic - even in "light residential"

[Seeb]

Plastic pipe was in the was the "Residential Sprinkler" section from the start. Because of cost, maintenance (you have to maintain and test steel pipe systems). But several other code violations have to occur for this to be a problem

[Seeb]

I've been to ICC meetings and the building industry was more pull in rule making than code officials

[Forester]

quote:

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Originally posted by csgray

Not many people can afford to play with "experimental" aircraft ...

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No, no, no ...

quote:

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Originally posted by Wao nahele kane

The current building criteria by default is substandard by virtue of it's own evolution and unrecorded variable and alterations within the evolution.

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Yes!

CSGray, I will grant you that there are plenty of ways to build outside of the building code that will lead to dangerous housing. But there are just as many ways to build safe, easy-to-maintain, affordable and durable -- as in, 1,000+ years -- houses, and I can't think of one that you could do within the code. These methods are not experimental. Rammed earth, for example, has been used for thousands of years.

In these cases, you would have to acquire a "variance," which is difficult and expensive because of (1) the rarity of engineers who have experience with or understand these methods, (2) the rarity of those engineers who will bother anyway when they can just stick with projects that only require them to ensure codes are met, and (3) the number of the remaining engineers who offer up plans without some sort of structural compromise that is made because an inspector will better recognize the result.

It is basically impossible to build a truly durable, affordable structure in today's code environment. Somehow, this needs to change.

[Wao nahele kane]

quote:

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Originally posted by Seeb

I've been to ICC meetings and the building industry was more pull in rule making than code officials

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No doubt the conventional building industry under the conventional manufacturers had "more pull". That's the problem, the current system has grown into a traditional method overbearing monster, trampling over the less conventional minded.


- Armed citizens provide security of a free State.

[Seeb]

There is an " or accepted engineering practice" clause.
also Appendix X in the state code may be a place to find some wiggle room, because it reference's books on traditional building

[peteadams]

"It is basically impossible to build a truly durable, affordable structure in today's code environment. Somehow, this needs to change."

As one example, Rob Tucker's "truly durable" Castleblock building materials which are routinely code approved here indicate that change is already here.