Special Master recommends Orchidland receivership

[kalakoa]

a back door way to make them responsible

If the County doesn't want to be "responsible", fine, they can waive permit requirements and property taxes too.

[Punaperson]

My fantasy has been to have a class action suit that holds real estate agents accountable for making huge amounts of money over the years for selling unrealistic expectations to naive buyers:

- " It's about a 20 minute drive into Hilo "
- " Of course they're going to pave the roads "
- " The community association takes care of your subdivision

These are statements made to new neighbors ( within the last 5 years ) by their real estate agents.

[My 2 cents]

quote:

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Originally posted by Chunkster

O'hara's bill was seen by the anti-PMAR crowd in HPP as a ploy to enable an eventual route through the subdivision. It was seen by the county as a back door way to make them responsible for at least a portion of the substandard private roads they enabled once upon a time. Obviously, it went nowhere.

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Ah, but maybe it did go somewhere.

"Based on the need to protect public health and safety"

Wouldn't this add fodder to our complaint? Not only did the county break their own laws in approving these subdivisions, but in doing so they have put our health and safety at risk.

Yes, I believe this is total bs, but if they're going to hide behind this kind of crap we might as well throw it back at them. Doesn't this make the situation all the more urgent?

[kalakoa]

Doesn't this make the situation all the more urgent?

I've reached "what's the point".

People are apparently willing to burn plenty time and money arguing about the problem, filing lawsuits, starting alternate boards, annual vehicle maintenance, spending an extra 10-20 minutes just to reach pavement, but somehow nobody can find any time nor money to sue the County who created the problem, nor is anyone interested in creating a LID that would outsource the road maintenance somewhere competent (or at least accountable).

It's also obvious that County doesn't care: we all pay fuel taxes, GET on our lawsuits and vehicle maintenance, property taxes on our "private ag lots" that become unreachable when it floods. When our elected Council members suggest substantive changes, they're quickly shut down by some special interest group -- and they even get to leverage a publicly-funded County department to make sure they're heard.

Population continues to grow, so the problem isn't going away. How bad does it have to get before enough people agree on a solution?

[kalakoa]

Interesting legal theory: if your association dues are used for unlicensed contractors and other shady dealings, are you "aiding and abetting" the commission of a crime?

Government uses the same argument against "terrorists", right?

[terracore]

quote:

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Originally posted by Punaperson

My fantasy has been to have a class action suit that holds real estate agents accountable for making huge amounts of money over the years for selling unrealistic expectations to naive buyers:

- " It's about a 20 minute drive into Hilo "
- " Of course they're going to pave the roads "
- " The community association takes care of your subdivision

These are statements made to new neighbors ( within the last 5 years ) by their real estate agents.

---

Sounds like they had sh!tty real estate agents (and there are a lot of them, I believe I've "fired" a total of 7). But none of the fairly competent agents I used ever misled me in that manner. One needs to do their due diligence when purchasing the most important thing in their lives, and that starts by gathering references and doing research on the agents that they are paying to assist them with that. All that being said, any of these agents will just use the excuse that they were giving the best information that they had available to them at the time. I tell people (when buying Puna property) to ONLY use agents that actually live in Puna, preferably as close to the subdivisions you are shopping as possible. And drive the commute during rush hour *when school is in session*, and visit any prospective property on a Friday night after 9 pm, park and listen to what your new neighbors (including the coquis) are going to sound like. Come back at about 4am to find out what the roosters are going to sound like.

[Punaperson]

terrracore: I absolutely agree with everything you said about using due diligence to make sure you know what you are buying.

Unfortunately, here as elsewhere, that's not always what happens.

I am frequently reminded of a George Carlin quote: 'Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that". I'm not trying to come off as someone who makes brilliant decisions all the time, but I am constantly amazed at how many take the words of real estate agents as the 'truth', because after all, they are the professionals.

Edit: After re-reading my post, I see that I need to clarify: people should not be labeled as stupid on the basis of one decision. However, that does not change the reality that some people make bad decisions about moving here.

It seems to me that two points come into play: it's always a matter of perspective, and you get what you pay for.

People who buy land in Puna are buying cheap land in the very poorest part of the state. Why is it cheap ? No infrastructure, no jobs, and it's a long way from anywhere. That's why it's cheap land. There are many subdivisions in Hilo that have all the amenities, but the price range is $175,000 - 200,000 - just for the lot. And the property taxes reflect those amenities. The property taxes in Puna are miniscule - reflecting the level of service and infrastructure. The state does not tax pensions - cheap to live here when you're retired, but little to no money is being contributed to upgrade the highway, or to build a wastewater treatment so commercial areas could expand.

For people who bought land because it was cheap to then grumble about legal shenanigans that happened 50-60 years ago seems to me to be misplaced. You don't want a long commute along Hwy 130 ? Why not move to Hilo - as it is now, your cheap land is costing you a long commute. ( As a side note for comparison, on Oahu, people who live in the bedroom community of Hawaii Kai pay well over $750,000 - 1,000,000 for a home, and have a longer, more congested commute than any Punatic. Many transplants from other parts of the state that I encounter at work laugh at the grumbles about traffic.) Again, it comes down to you get what you pay for.

[kalakoa]

For people who bought land because it was cheap to then grumble about legal shenanigans that happened 50-60 years ago seems to me to be misplaced.

Is it unreasonable to expect a better return on your mandatory HOA dues?

Perhaps it's unreasonable to expect anytthing from our elected officials. Yes, the shenanigans are decades old, but I would like to see a little more effort than "yeah that's too bad, here's your property tax bill" and that tired old "we can never ever afford to fix the problem".

[terracore]

"Why is it cheap ? No infrastructure, no jobs, and it's a long way from anywhere."

And your choices to have that land either on the flanks of an erupting volcano or in it's rift zones.

[randomq]

No infrastructure? Lots of workarounds (solar, wireless, rain and septic). No jobs? With an Internet connection you can route around the local economy. A long way from anywhere? Not really, to buy land this nice, cheap, unrestricted, and accessible you'd have to be hours outside of the city I used to live in.

I think we're all lucky to be able to live here, in a very undervalued place. If everyone quit bitching and started paying their road dues we could have some nicer roads. But not too nice, or we'll just become another suburb with nosy neighbors worried about property values!