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quote:
Originally posted by Greg
Hana Hou!! (Mahalo pog)
_____________________________________________________________________
I'm not defending anyone. What I've been saying is that if the "traffic diversion" bumps work at steering nuisance traffic away from streets(which you honkers contend they do), employ them on your street.
Can't afford them? nonsense. They don't cost thousands; they cost in the low hundreds. Much less expensive than the toll that stress has on the human body.
Me: Actually, the costs of the individual hump on a normal sized private road in our subdivision was $1500. If you multiply that by the number of bumps it does run into thousands. Puna Coastal is not a typically sized private road in our subdivision. It WOULD cost thousands.
The other thing I've been saying is if the volunteer BOD isn't representing you well, vote them out.
Me: That may happen. The election is in January.
I serve on my neighborhood board, and we've been accused of the same thing. It's usually by people who show up once a year at the annual meeting to vent. The elected volunteers meet monthly, and honestly do the best they can to meet the needs of a widely diverse population.
Me: Actually, you are partially correct. Typically, in this community it is also 'issue' driven that increases or impacts attendance. In 2007 someone placed flyers in mailboxes saying the Board was going to raise annual fees to $1500 and get rid of the riff raff by doing so. Within 2 days of the flyer going out on a week day at the Board meeting there were 70 plus people in attendance and only for that purpose. The discussion of the annual fee was not even on the agenda. So, issues like community assets and how they are being managed or maintained or anything having to do with money raise the awareness of the community.
One year, some of the opposing personalities got themselves elected to the board. We were thrilled that others were stepping up to help do some of the work. They didn't last long. Too many dang meetings.
I wonder what percentage of property owners in your neighborhood actually participate in electing and managing your business. I'm guessing under 10%. The people who do the work are the ones that show up and do the work. Be irate at the ones who do nothing.
Me: Again, typically about 10 per cent, correct. But, if it is issue driven then we see more like 15-20 per cent. It depends if it is a big topic in the community whether that vote is reflective primarily of the resident owner or is a collection of both the resident and non resident owner vote. Our subdivision has 2/3 of its ownership as non resident. That demographic is broken down even more when you factor in the Japanese owners who prefer to be outside the politics or issues of a community.
Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts. While we may disagree on traffic safety issues somewhat I appreciate the opinions of anyone who brings sound rationale to the discussion. But, it is always nice to know when someone who has spent time in the 'directors' shoes shows up to share because they speak from that perspective as well. You are right, volunteers should be supported and given thanks. That just does not seem to be the manner of the beast in this day and age. I would only add to your final thoughts on your comment above, making it to the Board meetings alone is not a way to stay informed either. You have to be at committee meetings, read the Minutes see what has changed in your home owner's association from month to month and ask if such changes are improving or decreasing your investment/property values? The Speed Humps are not on my road. Being installed down there does not directly impact my life. It does indirectly in that precedent is being set to allow individuals who live on a particular privately own community road to alter that road with the alterations then being maintained by the community. It shows a chasm opening up with preference being given to 'residents' on a street verses the 'owners' on a street.
Yet, the same Board is about to approve a change to our CCR's be sent out to the Membership for a vote that requires an owner who intends to build on their lot to notify all lot owners within like a hundred feet of the their lot so those owners can come and review the proposed plans and so they will know that 'noise' is about to happen on the lot. If the owner of a lot within 100 feet is not a resident, why? And before you say it, you are right, that vote would be altogether binding and rightly so. It is up to the Members to plead their case to one another. I am merely showing the inconsistencies in policies which always circle around to fitting an agenda of the few who are actively shaping the future. The Members need to inform themselves.
My apologies. I am veering off topic. Again, you are right. If Members are really concerned they should be at the meeting Thursday night and discuss those concerns! Here is hoping there will be an equable solution.
I am not bound to please thee with my answer. -- William Shakespeare
"Q might have done the right thing for the wrong reason, perhaps we need a good kick in our complacency to get us ready for what's ahead" -- Captain Picard, to Guinan (Q Who?)
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We put some speed bumps on my private street for about $100 ea. They work too. The $1,500 ones must be pretty fancy.
Assume the best and ask questions.
Punaweb moderator
Home made speed bump from female mold.
Cut plywood 'ribs' into desired shape of bump.
Use flexible luan plywood from HD and screw into plywood ribs to form a nice, smooth mold. Use cutouts from ribs as caps on ends.
Use pvc pipe to create voids for bolts.
Fill with cheapest concrete.
Let harden and repeat using same mold.
aloha,
pog
Posts: 210
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@ Rob, Apparently they chose to go with a professional asphalt company.
They are fancy! There is white paint splashed on a couple that looks like a giant bird pooped on them. Right next some of the humps are huge boulders lined up along the side the road. It is sort of like a kind of 'go cart' obstacle course where you start your course at Honolulu Landing, follow the big white lines that are like those lines you see that are huge in the foreground but are smallest in the back ground and light up alternately to let you know you are arriving upon a difference in the road surface? Then the hump...the big splat of paint on top...then driving a little while and the next set of white warning lines and just to the right a long line of huge raw boulders are placed just off the road shoulder. They aren't cleaned up; they aren't painted green or white or yellow or any sort of warning colors; then you arrive at the last hump. I haven't been down to see the 'new signs' or the alternate course some of the cars are taking over the grassy portion of the road shoulder. I guess go carts are better than bumper cars...
@Pog, you should have been at the meetings! I am sure that would have been far less expensive for the residents on the street that wanted the humps.
The price is not relevant because the 'residents' paid for it. The traffic studies; the limited choice of contact [residents vs. owners] for approval; the permission for 'residents' to alter a private community own road...the change in environment for a much bigger group of 'residents' on all side roads connecting Papio to Puna Coastal and Puna Coastal road itself and the rest of the 'detrimental' items noted in the ITE data contained in the 'proposed' policy already implemented that speak tot he concerns of those who do not favor. On Papio, perhaps they wonder why so many people are so concerned about what they did on their road. It is a natural response. They did not do it in secret. They did it over several committee and board meetings. Like all things, it is like tossing a rock in a pool of water and the results of that impact are felt farther out than just your side of the pool. If they owned every place those ripples would touch then surely they could toss the rock. But they don't. They don't even own the pool [analogous] .. it is own by all Members.
I am not bound to please thee with my answer. -- William Shakespeare
"Q might have done the right thing for the wrong reason, perhaps we need a good kick in our complacency to get us ready for what's ahead" -- Captain Picard, to Guinan (Q Who?)
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Aloha Dan,
Beware that Whitey not only does not tell the truth, he/she lies with intent. Please don't believe a thing this chronic blogger says! quote:
Originally posted by DanielP
Whitey,
Thanks for the history lesson. I was not aware. Very sad.
A signed petition is a possibility, but in light of what you are saying, perhaps not fruitful. This is classic small town politics. I, personally, would be looking to relocate, or....honk.
Dan
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Whitey,
May I ask that you back up this information with documentation. What licensed contractor quoted you $2200 per hump for CPP? Why 3 humps? Are you just copying what was done on Papio or have you actually assessed the need? The roads in HSCA are communally owned. The residents of Papio had been subject to speeding vehicles for years. They sought, to no avail, every possible recourse such as getting the police of Puna to actually enforce the laws. The rather progressive HSCA BOD is providing members an opportunity to make a difference in their community. The outcome - positive - every car that passes is not speeding any longer. Now there are impacts on other streets and it is up to those residents to decide how to handle. Those same residents just looked the other way when Papio Street residents voiced their concerns about the speeding. Classic example of don't give a damn unless it directly affects me.
Your personal rendition of the bogus law suit that drained HSCA of $150,000 dollars is so erroneous it would sink to the basement in a court of law. The banks filed suit because the former GenManager of the association tried to submit signature cards on a closed bank account (as in duh!)! Take that to the bank and back to court if you will. Further, the election that voted in the "new" board in 2007-08 was illegally conducted per the HSCA by-laws. What the members got from all those activities was a big fleece job and a do nothing board that let everything, including road cracks, shoulders and road edging fall into a state of disrepair. What a waste of money that could have been spent on improving infrastructure!
quote:
Originally posted by Whitey
Well said Greg. I applaud you for wearing the target in your community. It isn't easy and everything ends up being your fault.
The problem with the speed bumps is they must conform to a certain standard set by the board. The ones installed on Papio were $1500 each. There are 3 of them ($4500). The price for bumps on CPP are $2200 each (total $6600). We are not talking about a couple of hundred bucks. In the current economic climate it is hard to foresee the residents of CPP coming up with that kind of investment.
quote:
Originally posted by Gray Cat
Whitey,
May I ask that you back up this information with documentation. What licensed contractor quoted you $2200 per hump for CPP? Why 3 humps? Are you just copying what was done on Papio or have you actually assessed the need? The roads in HSCA are communally owned. The residents of Papio had been subject to speeding vehicles for years. They sought, to no avail, every possible recourse such as getting the police of Puna to actually enforce the laws. The rather progressive HSCA BOD is providing members an opportunity to make a difference in their community. The outcome - positive - every car that passes is not speeding any longer. Now there are impacts on other streets and it is up to those residents to decide how to handle. Those same residents just looked the other way when Papio Street residents voiced their concerns about the speeding. Classic example of don't give a damn unless it directly affects me.
Your personal rendition of the bogus law suit that drained HSCA of $150,000 dollars is so erroneous it would sink to the basement in a court of law. The banks filed suit because the former GenManager of the association tried to submit signature cards on a closed bank account (as in duh!)! Take that to the bank and back to court if you will. Further, the election that voted in the "new" board in 2007-08 was illegally conducted per the HSCA by-laws. What the members got from all those activities was a big fleece job and a do nothing board that let everything, including road cracks, shoulders and road edging fall into a state of disrepair. What a waste of money that could have been spent on improving infrastructure!
Hi,
I walked on Papio all the time and never thought there was a problem. Care to site the study where they proved there was a problem? I am sure the "progressive" board would have actually assessed a problem instead of just taking someones word or opinion right? Why is it fair to make neighborhood streets deal with highway traffic, when it is clear where the highway is supposed to go and has gone for hundreds of years? Please answer these two questions.
By the way, I don't care about your other fight, just the speed bumps, do not deflect.
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[quote]Originally posted by Gray Cat
Your personal rendition of the bogus law suit that drained HSCA of $150,000 dollars is so erroneous it would sink to the basement in a court of law. The banks filed suit because the former GenManager of the association tried to submit signature cards on a closed bank account (as in duh!)! Take that to the bank and back to court if you will. Further, the election that voted in the "new" board in 2007-08 was illegally conducted per the HSCA by-laws. What the members got from all those activities was a big fleece job and a do nothing board that let everything, including road cracks, shoulders and road edging fall into a state of disrepair. What a waste of money that could have been spent on improving infrastructure!
[quote]
GrayCat (Missus President) - Spoken like a true one-sider! Where is your documentation? I have reviewed much of the court record and the first bank to file for an interpleder was FHB. No closed account problems there! Only a bank manager that had been forwarned of a hostile takeover.
And what about those closed accounts at BOH...It seems very strange that a bank would freeze the open active assets of a corporation because someone filed new signature cards for a closed inactive account (as in duh!). If that is all it takes, then anyone could interfere with a corporation's assets by doing the same. Doubt it! There is more to it and you know it, it just doesn't serve your purpose for anyone else to know it.
Elections conducted illegally according to the HSCA Bylaws? Don't think so - prove it. The judge didn't think so either. He thought the whole mess was stupid. Locked everybody up in the courthouse until they agreed to a settlement. Nobody went to jail, nobody was ordered to foot the bill - The "parties", yep all of them, agreed to stop the nonsense. No one should be wearing that debacle as a badge of honor or a flag of victory!
But this is ancient history. As is in most things, I'm sure if the parties involved had it all to do over again, they would do it differently.
Regarding the estimates for the speed bumps - I did not get the estimates (some else did). Not sure which contractor was utilized. Just passing on information that I was given. The 3 humps were because there are 3 feeder streets from Papio to CPP.
"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." - Albert Einstein
Posts: 64
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Joined: Aug 2010
quote:
Originally posted by Gray Cat
Aloha Dan,
Beware that Whitey not only does not tell the truth, he/she lies with intent. Please don't believe a thing this chronic blogger says!
Yeah, "Don't trust Whitey"!
Isn't that a T-Shirt? I believe they are available at the Makuu Farmers Market from Monkeyfish!
Ms. GrayCat,
That's not a very nice thing to say about someone you don't know. I may see things differently than you do, but that does not make me a liar. Please try to stay on topic and not degrade to personal attacks.
Just to smooth the feathers of csgray (forum vs blog thread): I do not Blog, therefore I am not a chronic blogger. But I do make posts on several forums that I have interest in. That makes me unworthy of belief just how?
"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." - Albert Einstein
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