Rooster farms in HPP mapped. HEY Sputnut!

[Rob Tucker]

quote:

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Originally posted by EightFingers

Just to make it clear, my study is not me "taking a vigilante approach". It is simply to determine the affects of rooster ranches in the area.

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I was not suggesting you were. Frankly, I think your rooster mapping is a good service.

[Rob Tucker]

quote:

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Originally posted by kalakoa

Let's all take a ride on the paranoid conspiracy express.... just for a moment.

Rooster farms and helicopter overflights (and, of course, lack of infrastructure) are a major drag on property values -- almost as if "someone" wants to keep all the land "cheap" until they're ready to make their move.

They're perfectly willing to "allow" people their illegal cesspools and unpermitted shacks, because "someone" has to homestead the land for future development.

Does anyone really think the "status quo" can last forever?

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I think you are right. The CW is that Shipman Ltd. has extensive plans for shopping center and upscale residential on their lands along Hwy 130 someday. Those developments can't compete with thousands of Puna lots with water, power, decent roads. So keeping
Puna barefoot and pregnant serves someone's long term interests... so it is suggested to me.

[kalakoa]

I think Shipman et al will be disappointed with their long-term strategy.

It goes something like this...

Nobody wants to invest in the infrastructure because there's no money because nobody has any jobs because there's no investment. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Something has to tip the balance. Two possibilities: travel becomes cheap/fast enough that tourists can visit "for the weekend", or the island develops enough of an economy to make it practical to live here. I tend to think the latter is a possible outcome of travel/shipping becoming too expensive so that people are forced to participate in a local economy.

Case in point: property taxes are mailed to Seattle because the County makes choices based on "lowest bidder" -- but Seattle doesn't need more jobs, we do. If you look at the problem from a TCO perspective, hiring local is probably cheaper because most of that salary stays with your local economy -- even if Walmart gets a big piece, they still have to hire locally too.

Yes, the above is a bit of a fuzzy example; part of what makes off-island processing "cheaper" is the price of postage. If the USPS goes bankrupt and it's suddenly $20 to FedEX your property tax check to Seattle, people would pay their bills local, and County would have to hire more staff to process them...

[davidr]

This may be a little off the topic of roosters but I think we live in a country based on herd mentality. Twitter may not be a good investment but when the herd believes everybody is buying, many people don't want to miss out. Likewise, when the masses believe that they might miss out on cheap and plentiful Hawaiian property here in Puna, there will be an irrational stampede to get in on the deal. It partially explains how the developers were able to sell HOVE to the masses sight unseen!

[reni]

"Case in point: property taxes are mailed to Seattle because the County makes choices based on "lowest bidder" -- but Seattle doesn't need more jobs, we do. If you look at the problem from a TCO perspective, hiring local is probably cheaper because most of that salary stays with your local economy -- even if Walmart gets a big piece, they still have to hire locally too."
Excellent point.
...I make the trip to Hilo to pay my taxes in person, even if it means finding a parking stall and waiting in line. Would much prefer to pay here in Pahoa , especially if the person waiting on me was a newly hired into the workforce.
Ironically " the mass of unemployed poor people " is an industry on to itself with our state. Many are employed in this field!

[sputnut]

Rob, SpuTnut. Anyway, just to be clear, I don't care if they cockfight, just don't raise em next door to me. I would first exhaust every legal option before taking drastic measures, but for my sanity's sake they would have to go, one way or the other. That's all.

comin' your way soon!

[kalakoa]

I don't mail my property taxes because I don't trust a third-party to get it right.

Keeping jobs in the County is just an (excellent) side effect.

[HereOnThePrimalEdge]

quote:

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Originally posted by sputnut

but for my sanity's sake they would have to go, one way or the other.

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We don't make up our own laws for most things we encounter in our day to day lives. Somebody else sets the speed limit on the roads we drive, the county tells us what our property tax is, and somebody at one time made it legal to have roosters on agricultural land. No matter what the owner of the roosters does with them.

When you take the law into your own hands, you end up trying to resolve a problem like the Hatfield & McCoys, or the Posse Comitatus, or the KKK. They all have ideas about what is right from their own personal point of view, no matter what the law says.

As many others have suggested, it would probably be easier for you, and whoever your neighbors turn out to be, to buy property that is zoned residential. There would be no problem to begin with, so no problem to solve later on.

[Rob Tucker]

Here's something that is worse than roosters: Pig farms, egg farms. Nothing quite like steaming ponds of wet manure wafting in the breeze.

[kalakoa]

Actually, the laws are (theoretically) made by "we the people".

Take the initiative, collect signatures, and get some "rooster farming regulations" passed into law -- there's no need to make it "fully illegal", simply require a (large) minimum lot size, or maybe delegate the authority directly to subdivisions.

Of course, if County declines to enforce (as they have in the past) that's a different problem... but at least you "followed the process", right?